D&D 5E Sleeping PCs and threat

[zaratan]

Sorry for the newbie question, but if all PCs are sleeping and there is an ambush, will be an auto surprise round? PCs can use passive perception with penalty like -5? And elf's trance? If someone not surprised scream to the others wake up, there will be any test?

 

[Illithidbix]

It's somewhat up to the DM to determine exactly how they want to handle this, there is nothing specific for exactly what happens when the party is sleeping.

Personally I would myself rule:

The ambushers make a Dexterity(stealth) check vs:

Anyone asleep: Passive Wisdom(Perception) with Disadvantage, so their Passive Perception -5.
Anyone player party who is on watch at the time I would count as "actively searching for hiding creatures" - so would get to make a Wisdom (Perception) check vs the monster's stealth checks.

(It could be argued that unless they are specifically aware of who they are looking for this should just be passive Wisdom(Perception) score without disadvantage.)

And use the standard "Any character or monster that doesn't notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter"

Generally I presume the sound of combat will rouse anyone who is awake, I might rule that it *doesn't* if the ambushers (be they monsters or PCs) take down any guards or similarly awake in a way I might deem to be sufficiently silent (something like drop them to 0 hit points before they were even aware the attackers were there, so a sneak attack from range or with the attacker using Hide as their bonus action to move behind the target with a melee attack)
I am far more likely to rule this for players rather than have all the players murdered in their sleep.

So any character who was asleep can react as normal after the first round of combat. - But they'll be prone and likely without their armour and scrabble for their weapons.

 

[Jediking]

It depends on the situation and what the ambush is trying to accomplish. If ALL people were asleep in the wilderness, I'd probably just let the enemies ambush them. If all the PCs were in an inn and had no real reason to expect danger, that's a bit more of a 'gotcha' so would ask for a roll (although disadvantage/etc comes into play). [MENTION=12283]Illithidbix[/MENTION] has good points and that seems fair.

Personally, if someone was on watch I'd count that as actively looking (paying attention/guarding) and have them make a roll against the enemy Dexterity (Stealth) check (one Stealth check for the enemy group), but using the Passive Perception is also completely logical to use. If others are sleeping, I would not even call for a roll. On a fail the ambushers would get a surprise round on everyone, then combat as normal. If the watcher managed to spot the ambushers, he could whisper or yell out a warning.

I would count an elf to be watching as well. If he was staying up with another person and they were talking, maybe I'd use their Passive Perception. If the elf was in the midst of the trance, I might give him disadvantage.

 

[aco175]

I tend to rule that sleeping pc's are surprised if they fail a perception check with disadvantage. Awake characters and elves in trance do not have disadvantage. It may even take your movement action to stand and grab your weapon, grabbing your weapon may be part of your standing action.
The other point to think about is sleeping in armor or taking time to don armor. I think the books have donning time at 5 and 10 minutes. There is also arguments about being able to sleep in heavy armor since it is padded and formed to fit exactly. The last time it came up in my game one of the characters was keeping guard and heard the enemy coming. He was able to wake the pc's and they had a round to get ready. I think I should have placed a penalty on those in armor like a -2 or half the protection. This may be a compromise with sleeping in the armor but having it loosened and maybe part of it not worn.

 

[leonardoraele]

Everyone is surprised. Also, creatures have advantage on attacking them during this round.

However, a smart party will make a watch to avoid such threats. You decide the timing the ambush will take, and roll stealth against the Passive Perception of the character who is watching. If he notices something, he will awake the rest of the party.

 

[iserith]

Everyone is surprised. Also, creatures have advantage on attacking them during this round.

However, a smart party will make a watch to avoid such threats. You decide the timing the ambush will take, and roll stealth against the Passive Perception of the character who is watching. If he notices something, he will awake the rest of the party.

Agreed. You're either keeping alert for dangers or you're doing something else that prevents you from doing so. Sleeping fits the bill here in my view.

What makes this a challenge and not a screw job, however, is the DM making an effort to adequately telegraph the threat of a nighttime ambush. If you telegraph said threat and the players still choose to sleep without a guard or the like, that's on them.

 

[zaratan]

I'll probably rule that everyone is surprised, but the elf in trance can use passive perception with -5 penalty. The players are newbie in D&D (like me), so there is a good chance that they don't think in stay in guard. Even with the surprise round and auto crit in unconscious, this isn't a deadly encounter, and will teach them a lesson.

About sleeping in armor, I was thinking in make a Con test DC 10, if it fails, he will not recover 1/8 of hit dice (minimum) and 1 HP per level in medium armor and 1/4 hit dice and 2HP per level in heavy armor. Other ideas?

 

[Noctem]

Agreed. You're either keeping alert for dangers or you're doing something else that prevents you from doing so. Sleeping fits the bill here in my view.

What makes this a challenge and not a screw job, however, is the DM making an effort to adequately telegraph the threat of a nighttime ambush. If you telegraph said threat and the players still choose to sleep without a guard or the like, that's on them.

Agreed. "Bandits are known to rob people moving along this road, are you sure you want to sleep here without someone doing guard duty?"

 

[iserith]

Agreed. "Bandits are known to rob people moving along this road, are you sure you want to sleep here without someone doing guard duty?"

Yeah. I probably wouldn't ask them in that fashion, but would definitely establish the risk of banditry on the road at some point. I never liked the whole "Are you sure?" thing from the DM, but that's just me.

As to @zaratan's query "If someone not surprised scream to the others wake up, there will be any test?": This decision must be made by the DM. If the DM thinks someone's scream will wake up the others, then it does. If the DM thinks someone's scream will not wake up the others, then it does not. If the DM thinks it could go either way, then an ability check - Perception, perhaps - is the appropriate mechanic to apply to resolve the uncertainty.

 

[Noctem]

Oh sure, there's probably more covert ways to relaying the message. I just went with the version that basically says "you're about to get ganked, are you sure you want to bend over?"