• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

D&D 5E The cost of D&D 5E (it ain't so bad!)

My question is how big are those books? I don't mind paying $50 dollars for an RPG book if it's thick enough to stop a bullet. WOTC is really following Paizo since they charge about 50 bucks for their books but make them big enough to be a good value.

Would the people who oppose this cost rather buy a $25 dollar PHB without the Druid, Bard, and Gnome? Excluding those things would lower the cost...
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Li Shenron

Legend
I don't have any problem with the price tags, but for those who do, give it a try to see the cost in terms of depreciation over the years of gaming (as in accounting: spread the cost over the number of months or years you're going to play the game).

For instance, assume 3 years before a possible major revision, then the 3 core books are 50$/year, slightly more than 4$/month, or slightly less than 1$/week. Then pick the result that makes you least uncomfortable ;)
 

Texicles

First Post
In the grand scheme of entertainment value, I don't see this as an outrageous price (especially since the aforementioned Mearls tweets).

Let's say you have a 2 hour sessions every 2 weeks over Morrus' suggested 5-year lifespan, you've got 260 hours of entertainment. So, $0.58/hour to be entertained. Obviously, YMMV depending on frequency of play.

If I go to a dive bar near my house and stick to the beer special, I'm looking at $5-10/hour. If I go to a gun range, sometimes I spend more than $0.58/bullet, not to mention the cost of range time. Driving my pickup to the FLGS costs about 4 times that much in gas over the 15 minutes it takes to get there. Yeah, I'm kinda rednecky :erm:

But even at $1/hour, that's still a bargain for entertainment IMO. And for entertainment that involves problem solving, creativity, social interaction, infinite replayability, portability, no batteries necessary, won't give you a hangover and fun for the whole family, it's a steal.

Just like any long-term investment, the initial outlay sucks, but if it's something you plan to get a lot of use out of over an extended period of time, it's not so bad really.
 

billd91

Not your screen monkey (he/him)
Would the people who oppose this cost rather buy a $25 dollar PHB without the Druid, Bard, and Gnome? Excluding those things would lower the cost...

No. They might lower the price (I'm not convinced they really would), but their omission would raise other costs. Druids and bards are popular in the groups I'm in. Omitting them reduces the chances we'll be adopters.
 

Tovec

Explorer
If you cannot afford to spend $150 in a purchase that will net you (assuming it's a quality game) literally years' worth of entertainment given months of advance notice, you probably cannot afford to spend $120 on that purchase, either. You might tell yourself that you can afford $120, but the truth is that if you are unable to juggle your discretionary expenses over the next five months to make room for the D&D core books, you probably should not be spending any significant amount of money on entertainment products until you have stabilized your finances.

Which is really just a roundabout way of pointing out that WotC isn't (and shouldn't be) relying on the purchasing power of people who legitimately cannot afford their game to sustain their brand.

First, regardless whether or not it is personally affordable to me is irrelevant. If you read my post you would know 120 is more affordable than 150 by the sheer metric of being 30 dollars less. Also by way of gifts (a method I received most of my books of late) 120 is less of a price point for people than 150 dollars, once again being 30 dollars less. It is thus more affordable to others who personally see no value in the books at all and would not buy them for themselves but are buying them for me.

Second, I think that I am probably a better judge of my expenses than you. I know what I can afford and what I cannot afford. I can certainly judge whether 120 is less than 150 and if that price point is acceptable to my finanances. You cannot. Simply put: You don't know me, don't speak for me. I AM telling you that if they were 30 dollars less that I would be more likely to buy them.

Third, who are you to say that ANYONE should not be buying a product because they can't afford it? The previous installments of this game (that I purchased) have been (a) worth the money and (b) relatively inexpensive. Frankly I don't care if you think I should be spending my limited funds on something or not. That goes for others too. I would think WotC wants as many people as possible to buy their game. Or maybe you are correct and they are more like you. I didn't realize that a subsidiary of Hasbro are then more discerning in their customers than your typical crack dealer.

Fourth, you are actually saying that WotC shouldn't be relying upon me? A person who is MORE LIKELY to try their product (given the time/money to do so) than many others in his social circle. Rather you seem to be suggesting that they should price themselves for people who can afford it but won't actually buy it because they have no experience with it? Honestly I would expect WotC/Hasbro/any company to want as many customers as possible and something like a price tag that is 1/4 higher than it should be (based on inflation) seems to make them all that more unlikely to sell more units.

Granted, I, Tovec, should probably not spend my limited resources on this game or any game. But really that is not at all to say that WotC shouldn't be branding or marketing to me. Even with 0 bucks to spend on it I am about 10 000% more likely to buy it than my next door neighbour who could afford it. But really my inability to get it will be affected by my finances, instead it is more sharply being affected by WotC pricing themselves too high.

It could be gold-plated-gold, but if it costs me more than it is worth then I'm not buying it. And since it isn't gold-plated-gold, you have to start questioning prices.

And none of that has anything to do with this crap you say about "I might tell myself". *RANT REMOVED* I have to go back and censor myself because this really rubs me the wrong way. Who do you think you are to try and know what's in my head, my wallet, or WotC's for that matter? *GRUMBLES* Yeah, this has gotten me in a foul mood. Blocked for sure. *GOES TO BED*
 

GX.Sigma

Adventurer
My question is how big are those books? I don't mind paying $50 dollars for an RPG book if it's thick enough to stop a bullet. WOTC is really following Paizo since they charge about 50 bucks for their books but make them big enough to be a good value.
The books are 320 pages, same as the 3e and 4e books.
 

Dannager

First Post
First, regardless whether or not it is personally affordable to me is irrelevant. If you read my post you would know 120 is more affordable than 150 by the sheer metric of being 30 dollars less.

No, I got that.

Also by way of gifts (a method I received most of my books of late) 120 is less of a price point for people than 150 dollars, once again being 30 dollars less.

Or you could just have them buy you individual books. From Amazon.

Second, I think that I am probably a better judge of my expenses than you. I know what I can afford and what I cannot afford. I can certainly judge whether 120 is less than 150 and if that price point is acceptable to my finanances. You cannot. Simply put: You don't know me, don't speak for me. I AM telling you that if they were 30 dollars less that I would be more likely to buy them.

And I'm telling you that, were I in your financial situation (where, given five months to prepare my finances, spending $150 on years' worth of entertainment is simply not something I could afford), it wouldn't matter whether the books were $30 or $150. If I were in that situation, neither of those would feel like a responsible purchasing decision.

Third, who are you to say that ANYONE should not be buying a product because they can't afford it?

Some guy on the internet, I guess!

Fourth, you are actually saying that WotC shouldn't be relying upon me?

I don't know. Can you honestly say that you can be relied upon to make regular purchases of D&D products? Is it worth the opportunity cost for WotC to cater to you over people who have a greater amount of discretionary income, if they had to choose?

A person who is MORE LIKELY to try their product (given the time/money to do so) than many others in his social circle. Rather you seem to be suggesting that they should price themselves for people who can afford it but won't actually buy it because they have no experience with it?

Are you saying that the sort of people who can afford $150 are not the sort of people who plays tabletop roleplaying games? I think most of this thread would disagree with you.

Honestly I would expect WotC/Hasbro/any company to want as many customers as possible and something like a price tag that is 1/4 higher than it should be (based on inflation) seems to make them all that more unlikely to sell more units.

Are you saying that you understand WotC's market research better than they do?

Granted, I, Tovec, should probably not spend my limited resources on this game or any game. But really that is not at all to say that WotC shouldn't be branding or marketing to me. Even with 0 bucks to spend on it I am about 10 000% more likely to buy it than my next door neighbour who could afford it.

You might consider that neither you nor your neighbor are the core target audience of the product line.

It could be gold-plated-gold, but if it costs me more than it is worth then I'm not buying it.

I'm very nearly certain (But, then again, I'm not you! How could I possibly know?) that you regularly make entertainment-related purchasing decisions with a poorer cost-vs.-value proposition than the Dungeons & Dragons core books, which (again, assuming it is a quality game) will probably net you hundreds of hours of enjoyment for you and your friends, with a cost per hour of under $1.

And none of that has anything to do with this crap you say about "I might tell myself". *RANT REMOVED* I have to go back and censor myself because this really rubs me the wrong way. Who do you think you are to try and know what's in my head, my wallet, or WotC's for that matter?

But obviously it's totally fine for you to second-guess the wisdom of WotC's price point decisions based on their failure to meet your personal requirements!
 
Last edited:

billd91

Not your screen monkey (he/him)
Are you saying that you understand WotC's market research better than they do?

I think he's saying that they'd sell more units if the price were lower. That's not exactly controversial, is it? There may be questions of profitability goals that WotC would know that we don't that may drive a particular pricing strategy, but the idea that the game would be more attractive to a buyer at $10 less per book seems pretty solid to me.


But obviously it's totally fine for you to second-guess the wisdom of WotC's price point decisions based on their failure to meet your personal requirements!

Considering the general expectations about not getting personal or ascribing ulterior motives to posters around here, that's pretty much the case. Second guessing a game company's decisions and whether it's following a good strategy are fair game. Snarking at other posters is not.
 

Primal

First Post
Does it help to know the Canadian Amazon has them listed at $33 in US dollars, which likely means the US Amazon will adjust to that price at some point prior to release?

Does $33 feel better? $99 for all three books?

It doesn't help us Scandinavians, who have to dish out 50 euros (68,6 USD) per book. If I order the books from Amazon, I also have to pay for shipping + taxes; perhaps roughly around 100-200 USD. My last order from US (a relatively small pack of minis) cost me 500 euros + 300 euros (450 USD) for shipping and taxes! :erm:

I'm pretty happy with Pathfinder, so I'm not going to purchase Next just out of support or curiosity. I'll probably check it out when my library network acquires the core rulebooks, and I might run it for the childen and teens at the library RPG club, but I doubt my group is interested in switching -- unless it's dramatically different from the final playtest packet.
 

Dannager

First Post
I think he's saying that they'd sell more units if the price were lower.

No, he said that WotC wants as many customers as possible. That's not true. If size of customer base were their only concern, the game would be free. They have to (like any business!) balance their desire to grow their customer base against the necessity of making a quality product - a product that incurs costs which must be recouped. That's why price points exist.

There may be questions of profitability goals that WotC would know that we don't that may drive a particular pricing strategy, but the idea that the game would be more attractive to a buyer at $10 less per book seems pretty solid to me.

Not if cutting that $10 out prevented WotC from making a product that met their standards for the brand.

Again, this whole argument is predicated on the notion that WotC has no idea what it's doing when it comes to business. Do you feel that's a particularly solid position?

Considering the general expectations about not getting personal or ascribing ulterior motives to posters around here, that's pretty much the case. Second guessing a game company's decisions and whether it's following a good strategy are fair game. Snarking at other posters is not.

Second-guessing the financial decisions of a company you know nothing of, internally, and whose employees (including some who are no doubt at least partly responsible for those very financial decisions!) are known to read this board is fine, but second-guessing the financial decisions of a forum poster for whom we know that $150 is a prohibitive cost is off limits?

Come on.

Look, I can appreciate his desire not to have his personal finances scrutinized (and that's not what has happened here - we're talking about his singular decision to not purchase the D&D core books, nothing else; there was no ascribing of ulterior motives, and nothing more "personal" than discussing a financial decision that he brought up to begin with), but if he didn't want the logic behind his purchasing decisions to be a topic for discussion, he didn't have to discuss the logic behind his purchasing decisions on a message board.
 
Last edited:

Remove ads

Top