The Stigma of D&D OR Help! I'm Stuck in the D&D Closet?

[WizarDru]

D&D stigmatises you only because you let it: there are a lot more gamers out there than you might realise

Word.

Personally, if your friends are really "smart, mature and fun people", as you describe them, then I think you're selling them short. If you walk around, embarassed about your hobby, you'll project insecurity and reinforce the stereotype you seem to think everyone perceives.

Newflash: there are a lot of former and current D&D players out there. True Story: When i was working for a major government contractor a couple of years back, I overheard a consultant talking with one of the project managers:
"What's that on your desk, there?"
" Hmm? What, that? That's one of my D&D books. The Player's Handbook."
"Oh yeah? You play that?"
"Yeah. We're everywhere, man."
"Heh. Yeah, I remember playing that back in the day."

Second true story: Gurlz play D&D too, d00d. Just ask my wife. Or Buttercup. Or Kidcthulu. Or Siala. Or any number of women here on ENworld or elsewhere. And for every woman who games, there are at least two who don't think twice about it.

It's a hobby, just like any other. If you were RC-car modeling and racing, model rocketing, historical recreating, black-powder shooting, canvas painting, frisbee golfing, model railroading or any of a thousand other hobbies, the reaction isn't much different, if handled properly. Turn it into a chance to make new gamers, or share information about your hobby. People where I work know that I play D&D, just like they know another coworker plays racquetball, another skydives and another plays nationally at Bridge tournaments.

Don't sell people short. They can suprise you.

If your friends can't accept you as you are, then maybe they're not as good a set of friends as you think. Personally, I'll bet they'd say..."Oh. That's cool, I guess. We still on for going out later?"

 

[Turanil]

Look, you can say whatever you want, but a girl looks on my desk and realizes this 23 year old owns a "Dungeons and Dragons Dungeon Masters Guide," and she's gonna have second thoughts.

What to say when the guy who has many D&D books is 42 years old!!

It's probably why no women ever come home!

 

[Wolfspirit]

Most places I've ever worked, I've been pretty up front about my geekiness, but when you play at LEAST a game a week, play all sorts of CRPGS, and are a Celtic Groupie, then it's better to inundate your co-workers so that they reach their saturation point of "Wow, this guy is a geek", rather than slowly stringing it out.

As with girls, well, RPing etc is such a big part of me that if a girl couldn't accept that, then it's definatly not going to work out anyways.

 

[Aust Diamondew]

Everything people have said sounds good. I've got one thing to add. I don't want to play d20 fantasy. I want to play DnD, the words have got more flavor and they don't sound like generic dollar general RPG.

 

[Breakdaddy]

People can say whatever they like, but I certainly feel the original poster's pain. I am 31 years old now, but I remember in high school not ever wanting to mention D&D because of the stigma attached to it. One of my pals mentioned it in passing once and was a social leper for the rest of the year. Now we are all grown up and wiser (I hope!), but the lingering sensation of mild apprehension still exists in social settings. Some people treat you like you just told them you dont shower regularly when you tell them you play D&D. Look, we all know that mature grown ups should overlook this and blah blah blah, but they dont always! I keep my books in several large boxes in the closet, and dont leave them lying about when I have company. I envy those of you who wear the hobby like a badge of honor, I am simply not as secure about this aspect of my life while around people who dont participate in the hobby.

 

[Gregor]

I hide my books when I bring girls home to my place for the first time. Look, you can say whatever you want, but a girl looks on my desk and realizes this 23 year old owns a "Dungeons and Dragons Dungeon Masters Guide," and she's gonna have second thoughts. I think in horror of the time when I forgot and had to explain.

Ya this happened to me once. Haha, that was an interesting night.

That I'm a grown up adult with a job, responsibilities, who likes going to the bars, and going out for parties, and going out on dates.

I too am in the d&d closet. I love d&d, dont get me wrong, and I would hate to never be able to play it again, but I too am an adult with responsibilities and I like to go to bars, go to parties and go on dates.

I guess what we have to remind ourselves of is that the stigma will probably always remain even if we made it a d20 fantasy. We would still need to explain it to our friends and dates and we would invariably be met with the question: "d20 fantasy? You mean like d&d?"

(parental wisdom on) In short, I have no answer. I just think that I must keep telling myself that if my friends are truly my friends and the women I date are truly interested in me, then I shouldent have to hide my true loves and hobbies from them. (parental wisdom off)

Cheers (and good article btw)

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

My 2 Cp.

First up, I feel for you - I'm in the process of removing myself from a DnD closet. Didn't talk about it for years, but decided it was such a big part of my life that I was hiding from a lot of people... Didn't seem like an altogether healthy way to behave, so I decided to change.

Frankly, it's worth it - had a few people s about it a bit and some crack the odd geek joke - but not in a malicious way... Nothing I can't deal with! Reactions seem to vary between 'don't really care' or 'vague interest'. I feel much better for it and have even met a decent new recruit player.

I'm not suggesting it's the first thing I talk about when I meet people, but if we get on to the topic of spare time then I'll normally mention it.

As far as rebranding it D20 fantasy goes - IMO, it won't change the 'geekiness' factor of it. If you want to look at it like that: it still going to be a bunch of people sitting around a table using funny shaped dice to play make believe? So what? It is geeky. So's most people's hobbies?

I mean, most hobbies look pretty 'geeky' when you examine them with that critical eye: IME, the worst offender is golf - my father and his golfing buddies spend a fortune on the game, watch it or pore over rulebooks while not playing and are collectively the worst bunch of rules lawyers I've ever seen...

 

[DragonLancer]

I've had a similar discussion on the Necromancer Games boards a few weeks ago, and it seems that there is a stigma attached in the US. Here in the UK, it doesn't seem to exist. As a matter of fact I've had people come to ke to ask about it, and I've even had it go down well in job interviews - something that seems an anathema to US companies according to posters on the nG forums.

 

[The Baron]

I wanna thank you all for the responses. They were really helpful!

I guess there are times when I create a lot of the problem in my own head. I'm sure most of my friends probably don't care / have hobbies that they don't share with people.

But I still think there's a kernal of truth, breeding in most high schools in America, tied to these ideals of what's "cool" and "not cool." And D and D, in general (or, at least in my high school), falls into the "not cool" catagory. I guess, I just hoped this wasn't there. I was very concerned, as many kids are, about "fitting in" in high school.

If I hadn't been, I'd have been playing D and D for much more of my life.

But I'm sure there's many people out there who never decided to play because of a stigma (percieved or real). And I still think the name and setting has something to do with that. And that latest popularized release of that setting was a crappy fantasy movie, which I'm sure did not help. And I really don't think more people playing is a bad thing. Mainstream? Well, seems the more people that play this game, the higher the quality of the product, and I don't mind that. Wizards makes more money, more money gets returned to the designers. Nothing wrong there.

Though I guess this is sort of a side note, I would like a more "baseline" rules book. From a setting design standpoint, it just seems like godsend. Basic classes and a ways to build new ones. Barebones skills and feats. Keep the spells simple. Get your basic weapons and armor. You can still go to your D and D Setting Book to get all the flavor you want. I guess I'm just a less-specifics, more flexibility type of guy. I'd rather have the big bucket of legos than the lego ship to piece together.

And although d20 fantasy is my thing, Dungeons and Dragons, to a certain degree, is not. I feel a more baseline rule book would encourage more creativity among devlopers, whether it's Wizards of the Coast or lil' or me at my computer. Easier to draw outside the lines when they're not there.

 

[humble minion]

My solution: baby steps.

First, when the subject comes up, you explain that you do 'roleplaying' (no jokes that would offend Eric's grandmother please!). If the person you're talking to knows what you're talking about, then they're a fellow geek/have tried it themselves/whatever. If not, they'll ask 'what's that?', to which you explain that it's something like improvisational theatre, and that at the moment you're working in a world similar to Lord of the Rings. From this, you talk about the characters, personalities and events in your game (only if they show any interest, mind!) The dreaded D words can be gently broached after that, by which time, if you're a good talker, you've already convinced this person that there's this awesomely cool pastime that's somehow passed them by. It's worked for me - I have a 21-year-old fundamentalist Christian from Seattle itching to play in my group if she ever manages to head down to Australia...

Or you can just point them as Sepulchraves story hour, and let it do your talking. And hope that you don't raise their expectations too much.