UA: New Race Options, Eladrin and Gith

The Eladrin ability score adjustment needs to be: +2 Charisma, +1 any other.

Charisma and all of its connotations [charm, innate magic, bardic song, etcetera] is what best represents the Fey Elf concept.

Intelligence is an accident of D&D only having Wizard class in the beginning, but it has merit in folklore too.

Dexterity is irrelevant.

Maybe handsized sprites connote Dexterity, but humansized spirits of magic, less so.



Edit.

Elves can work better this way:

Wood Elf: +2 Dexterity
High Elf: +2 Intelligence
Eladrin Elf: +2 Charisma

That is what the Elf feels like.



Edit.

High Elf
+2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence (!)
Trance
Investigation skill proficiency
Languages: Elven, Sylvan, and Common
Cantrip
Elven Armor (permanent Mage Armor, appears as supple chain armor or as invisible force)
High Elf Weapon Training (longsword proficiency, treat as finesse weapon and spell focus)
(Darkvision too?)



Edit.

Eladrin are a group of elves that are native to the Fey Plane. They feel like a separate race of Elf with their own four subraces. The concept of the Eladrin evolves across the editions, and their association with the four seasons seems to enjoy traction. They consolidate well into four kinds of Eladrin, each one corresponding to a season.

Eladrin Elf
• Spring: +2 Charisma, +1 Dexterity (Ghael, Coure)
• Summer: +2 Charisma, +1 Strength (Firre, Bralani)
• Autumn: +2 Charisma, +1 Intelligence (Tulani)
• Winter: +2 Charisma, +1 Wisdom (Noviere, Shiere)

 

[The Human Target]

I guess that I am am in the minority as I do not like the Four Seasons personality or the Shifting Seasons cantrips. As for the Gith, I have no reason to give them a look. I have disliked them since they first appeared the Fiend Folio, will not use/include them as a DM, and will not play in a camp that allows them as PCs- OMMV.

I somehow am still shocked by the incredibly strong opinions people have about D&D stuff I consider to be totally trivial.

 

[Yaarel]

This seems like it's just a wholesale replacement for the high elf. Why would you take a high elf? I mean, sure, if you really want a cantrip that isn't one of the four best wizard cantrips in the game, that you can choose to switch between every morning, you might want to take high elf, but that's a pretty slim argument. The elf weapon training high elves get is almost always redundant or useless and all they get otherwise over the eladrin is an extra language. Yay.

This is just massive power creep but of course, because it'll be popular, it'll probably go through.

The PH High Elf design is underpowered and in need of an upgrade to be mechanically competitive with other races.

 

[Morrus]

I somehow am still shocked by the incredibly strong opinions people have about D&D stuff I consider to be totally trivial.

Ah. New to the internet, are we?

 

[Mistwell]

Thunderwave is a 1st level spell. BB, GFB are both only good on classes that either have access to it already, or clerics and rogues. And even then, it's arguable for the rogue since it denies a bonus action attack with an off-hand weapon. Frostbite is an OK cantrip, but it's nothing special. Lightning Lure, Mold Earth, Ray of Frost and Thunderclap are not very good cantrips at all. Only ray of frost is even slightly comparable to fire bolt, and even then is definitely the weakest of the alternative attack cantrips. Fire Bolt is the damage cantrip of choice for a wizard, friends is a very powerful charm effect when you consider that anyone you use it on, isn't going to be around after 1 minute, it can be used to intimidate (so you're angering them anyway), charm person has the target realise they've been charmed and is a 1st level spell, and there's no saving throw for friends where there is for charm person. Minor illusion is one of the best cantrips in the game. In the hands of an imaginative player, it's incredibly powerful, and chill touch is the third best attack cantrip (only one better than it is shocking grasp).

Other than putting in message and shocking grasp, they couldn't have chosen better cantrips for the four to choose from. You're essentially getting four of the best cantrips compared to one, plus misty step, plus being able to choose charisma instead of int. Int is useless for anything other than a wizard, while charisma is used as primary in two classes, secondary in two others, and is good for everyone because of the power of the associated skills, and there being more (and more important) cha saves than int.

So yeah, it's a massive power boost and makes high elf almost redundant except for a few corner cases.

How about we agree to disagree? You appear to have substituted your personal opinion on which are the "best" cantrips, an opinion I think isn't particularly well shared in opinion polls or build guides I might add, for fact on this one.

 

[dropbear8mybaby]

The PH High Elf design is underpowered and in need of an upgrade to be mechanically competitive with other races.

I agree.

How about we agree to disagree? You appear to have substituted your personal opinion on which are the "best" cantrips, an opinion I think isn't particularly well shared in opinion polls or build guides I might add, for fact on this one.

How about you provide proof otherwise? Show these "polls" and "build guides" that prove your point. You're the one who said there was value in being able to choose a single cantrip over having access to any of a set of four. That's your opinion as well. Using the fallacious argument that "it's your opinion" is just a means to shut down argument because you can't be bothered providing the proof to back up your own claims.

Show me a build where the high elf having the choice of cantrip is a better option than the eladrin.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

Githzerai dwell in limbo which is dangerous and chaotic when someone isn't forcing their will on it, which takes great disciple, and a constant awareness of their surroundings, which pushed the Githzerai towards a lifestyle akin to monks in order to force stability on their sections of limbo. So even non monks get a basic monk training so they can survive in limbo.

Monk training does not help one survive in Limbo, there was a skill/non-weapon proficiency called Chaos-Shaping that was based on either INT or WIS which allowed anyone to shape the environment around them. While being 2e they just made a non-weapon proficiency for anything, Chaos-shaping had nothing to do with Monk training and shouldn't at all, even ignoring 2e's general lack of Monk class. In 5e terms Chaos-shaping would be nothing more than a simple INT or WIS check. The ones who kept the Githzerai settlements "stable" were the Anarchs Guild which had nothing to do with being Monks, and if any of their members had character classes they'd probably be Wizards or Mystics/Psions.

 

[seebs]

I somehow am still shocked by the incredibly strong opinions people have about D&D stuff I consider to be totally trivial.

I've been doing this since the late 80s and... yeah, still sometimes a bit shocked.

 

[Yaarel]

The PH High Elf probably balances mechanically by keeping it as-is, while upgrading its ability score adjustments to +2 Intelligence, +2 Dexterity.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

I'll start working on new characters concept right away since there's still time before we start our new OotA campaign next week.
- Githyanki Undying Warlock (the Lich Queen), Blade Pact (silver great sword)
- Githyanki Horizon walker, FE: Aberration
- Githyanki Eldritch Knight
- Zerai Knowledge cleric
- Zerai Chaos Sorcerer
- Zerai Open Hand monk
- Eladrin Glamour Bard
- Eladrin fey-lock
- Eladrin Primeval gardian

So many new ideas. Love new UAs, each time it triggers my imagination.

 

[Mistwell]

I agree.


How about you provide proof otherwise? Show these "polls" and "build guides" that prove your point. You're the one who said there was value in being able to choose a single cantrip over having access to any of a set of four. That's your opinion as well. Using the fallacious argument that "it's your opinion" is just a means to shut down argument because you can't be bothered providing the proof to back up your own claims.

Show me a build where the high elf having the choice of cantrip is a better option than the eladrin.

There is no fallacy of "it's just your opinion". Pointing out you're substituting opinion for fact on a subjective matter is in fact rather sound argumentation. If you feel it shuts down the argument, that's probably a sign it's a really good retort.

It IS in fact your opinion, right? It IS a subjective issue, right? Assuming both answers are yes, it's not really well suited to some argument about what is best. It's like arguing which is the "best" color.

But if you care to check build guides, you know where to find them. I put a lot of work into copying them over from the old WOTC boards, other people put a lot of work into making them, and then making more of them, and then us all collating them into a directory, and then still others turned it into a wiki page here recently. Go look if you're curious. You can also search for the cantrips polls if you like. I see no point in chasing this subjective topic further though. You want to be "right" on a matter of subjective opinion. Good luck with that.

For me, being able to choose provides the power of flexibility that the rigidity of the Eladrin doesn't provide. For you, the Eladrin happens to provide almost all of your favorite cantrips. It sounds like a good match for your tastes. That does not, however, mean your opinion is universal or even well shared by a majority such that it is overpowered simply because you happen to like those cantrips.

And if you think the burden of proof is on me to prove you wrong, you are incorrect. You are the one that made the claim it's "Massively" overpowered because it provides "the best" cantrips. The burden is on you to prove they are considered "the best", not on me to disprove your bald assertion