Welcome to the 5th anniversary!

[BSF]

And to the poster who said it's slow on high speed connection, try running it at 28.8 dialup and tell me how slow it is.

It's not too bad at that speed, all things considered. Still, compared to the 8Mbps I use at work ...

Well, compared to work everything is slow at home.

 

[buzz]

Well, I was dissappointed, but now I am pissed. You're implying that it isn't professional!? That I don't know what the Hell I'm doing but need to have my hand held even after redesigning - on contract - the entire Wizard's of the Coast web board?

Michael, it may be time to step away from the keyboard for a bit. You're inferring something that's not in what I wrote.

By "mostly professional" I'm only saying that the sites I've used as examples of where I'm coming from (and what I think looks good) aren't just sites I think are pretty, but sites designed by some of the most-sought-after designers around, i.e., people who get paid big money by large corporations (and HappyCog.com and Zeldman.com done by the author of one of the definitive books on current design techniques). I.e., when I talk about white-on-black or text-on-texture being hard to read, I'm citing principles that are part-and-parcel of graphic design. Design isn't just about creating art, it's about creating tools. A Web site is a tool, and functionality needs to come first.

Like I said, I'm just one person, and I certainly appreciate all the work that you do for ENWorld. That's one of the many reasons I feel it's worth paying to be a community supporter, and why I help organize Chicago Gameday. I sincerely apologize if I've bummed you out.

While I don't agree with them, there are obviously people who really like the new theme (as they've spoken up right here). Nonetheless, I just feel compelled to comment. I'm not crabbing just because there's been change; I wasn't all that enamored of the old theme, but it was usable. I simply don't like the new theme, and I think there are sound, design-specific reasons why.

But, like I said, as long as there are alternative themes, I'm okay, and you can tell me to shut up.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

See, there's the point that gets me thinking...the last 2 times I've seen major design changes (and said my comments about them), they were changes that just appeared. Nobody else has control over site design and changes are not publicised in advance, and the one style I would bet most people use, is the one always changing.

Just wanted to tell you that these changes and such were 'polled' as sorts, but not to the public. Really, there's just too many people here on ENWorld to make that possible. But Michael had a bunch of threads on 'how does this look' 'what about this?' etc etc all through the Staff Forum as this was being tweaked. So it isn't just his doing. Blame everyone with access to that forum.

 

[Zappo]

I like the new style.

MM, keep in mind that people who post on a thread are more likely to be the ones who disagree with the change. For example, I wouldn't have posted if I didn't feel the need to say this. I'm positive that most enworlders like the change.

 

[Starman]

FWIW, I like the new look. I really like it, in fact. I don't have a problem reading light text on a dark background and the textures don't make it a problem, either. I also haven't noticed the site as being any slower than it was before the change and I am on a crappy dial-up connection.

Starman

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

See, there's the point that gets me thinking...the last 2 times I've seen major design changes (and said my comments about them), they were changes that just appeared. Nobody else has control over site design and changes are not publicised in advance, and the one style I would bet most people use, is the one always changing.

snip

That's just my thoughts.

While that would be nice, it is not reasonable to think that the staff here should take the time to check with the - how many? 20,000 users of this site? - before they make changes. And what would be the criteria for allowing a change? Loudest complaints win? Majority rule? If 51% hate the look and 49% like it, does that mean they should not implement it?

I trust that, as Ankh-Morpork Guard stated, the rest of the staff is in on making decisions about the site, there are good reasons behind them (such as improved security and functionality), and that it is not one person just making changes willy-nilly.

We are members of EN World, not owners. We are not owed anything by the people who put this site together and keep it running.

 

[jezter6]

I don't 'expect' ownership of anything, but it would be nice to see changes and be able to comment on them before, rather than complaining about them later. I don't think it's unreasonable to post a sticky where people can see it and give it a few weeks for comments before going ahead with it.

The only reason I really thought it would be a good idea is the typical 'put up or shut up' argument that many people on this board use. It was really in reply to another poster saying that we (as a community) don't do anything on our own to keep the site working and looking good. And you can't give all of us access to forum code. I have no problem contributing in any way I can to the design of EN World, but if we're locked out (threads with pretty pictures of the new forum look in a secret forum) there aint a whole lot any of us can do to contribute.

Boiling it all down, it would be nice if we had some input before things went into place (even if it's largely ignored, at least we voiced our opinions), and old things stayed old and new things became opitions instead of standard.

-jez, who doesn't like the last 2 forum looks, still looking for plain old black, no fancy backgrounds, no fancy backgrounds inside the 'quote' and 'reply' buttons.

 

[RangerWickett]

Michael, I like most of the changes so far (actually, what happened to that nifty patterned background we had yesterday?). The only thing I'm not too keen on is this new white stripe after each post. I know I have often in the past been against change just for change's sake, but I like the site when it's mostly dark, and the bright white stripe throws things off for me. A darker color would probably work fine, though.

Keep up the good work, and remember, most of us like the site as it is. If you get grumblings when you change something, just remember that it's not like the site needs to change appearance.

 

[barsoomcore]

BTW: paying to visit ENWorld in my opinion does not entitle you to anything.

(snip)

IMHO the money I volunteer does not give me any rights other than to come here to enjoy and participate in this great comunity.

In my not-at-all-humble opinion, participating in this great community MEANS trying to improve it when and how I can. If I see something that I think needs changing, how am I being a good member of the community if I DON'T speak up? I don't feel ENTITLED to point out things I think need to be improved. I feel REQUIRED to do so. It's my duty as a good member of this community to try and keep it healthy.

The people making these changes should WELCOME input -- whether it applauds or condemns their work. Their drive ought to be to make this site as useful, as powerful and as comfortable as possible for ALL users. If that's not what they're trying to do, then they're in the wrong game. If they don't want to hear my opinion. then they should say so and I'll shut up.

And take my thinking elsewhere.

But I honestly believe that Michael and Morrus and all the hard-working moderators, and indeed the majority of the users like myself, honestly want to make this site BETTER. That means we all have to contribute our brainpower to the collective pool, offering our opinions and treating each other with respect. NOT shutting up and accepting whatever's given to us just because it was hard work.

I value hard work when it's in the service of making things better, not in and of itself. I understand Michael worked very hard to create this theme. That doesn't make it in and of itself a worthwhile venture, and I won't insult his intelligence by lying to him about what I think of it. And I expect from him no response to my input other than, "Thanks for the input." He may or may not pay the slightest bit of attention to what I'm saying -- he's the big web wazoo and I trust him to do what's in the best interest of the community. But he needs my input -- he needs EVERYBODY'S input -- to do his job properly, and so it's my duty to give it to him, whenever it's anything besides "Meh."

To say that giving blind approval at all times is being a better community member is hogwash. Good members of the community speak out on issues they care about, because they want things to be better.

 

[Michael Morris]

Michael, I like most of the changes so far (actually, what happened to that nifty patterned background we had yesterday?). The only thing I'm not too keen on is this new white stripe after each post. I know I have often in the past been against change just for change's sake, but I like the site when it's mostly dark, and the bright white stripe throws things off for me. A darker color would probably work fine, though.

Keep up the good work, and remember, most of us like the site as it is. If you get grumblings when you change something, just remember that it's not like the site needs to change appearance.

Bright white stripe? Missing pattern?? Sounds like you're missing some images - hit refresh on the browser to reload all the images.