D&D 5E What's the rush? Has the "here and now" been replaced by the "next level" attitude?

Celebrim

Legend
1) Deemphasizing story, exploration, and puzzle solving player skill relative to character abilities and tactical play has made leveling more satisfying relative to the whole experience. This isn't entirely new, as hack-n-slash has been around a while, but it does seem to be becoming the more assumed style of play.

2) There has been a move away from open ended adventuring and toward closed ended adventuring as is typified by the adventure path concept. The way people experience stories now is very much focused on the linear narrative coupled to regular increases in character ability. In particular that there is an expectation of reaching 20th level and that most of what is satisfying about play is obtained at those upper levels - story conclusions, epiphany, accomplishment, recognition, etc. Again, this isn't entirely new - GDQ and DL were adventure paths long before anyone had a term for it - but WotC's initial module releases and Paizo's greater success with the concept has made that default. I never played a 1e character up above about 13th level, and that took years playing 6 hours every week - because for me adventure path wasn't default. Now people expect to rush up to 20th level in the course of 20-30 sessions of play.

3) Leveling up is just more satisfying than it used to be. More stuff happens. Hand in hand with that is that people plan out their characters ahead of time to a much greater degree than usual. Many players will know exactly what they want to achieve mechanically at every level. They want to complete a concept, and in general the fullness of the concept is usually only realized at quite high levels. When I created a character in 1e I never paid any attention to who he might be in the future. It was enough to figure out who he was. Now I see so many players that have no clue who their character is, only what they want him to be able to do in the future. You ask what their concept is and they start spouting mechanics, feats, and classes they want to take.

4) There is an increased perception that high level is normal. There is an e6 crowd out there and people like me who though they aren't e6 still demographically have expectations informed by the same sort of concepts. When I was younger, if someone would have asked me where 'high level play' begins I would have said 9th level. I associated playing at or above 15th level with junior high kids that didn't know better, who were being power leveled by their DMs because XP and loot were the only rewards of value they could offer. Now, 15th level is normal. Everyone expects to reach and exceed it.

5) Everybody plays cRPGs now and cRPGs skinner box players really well by doling out leveling opportunities like crack laced candy. In many cases the whole point of playing a cRPG is to level up to high and higher levels. Diablo may have been inspired by Nethack and D&D, but now the tables are turned - Diablo now influences D&D more than D&D influences it. People used to play cRPGs to try to emulate their experiences in a PnP game. Now they play PnP games trying to emulate their experiences in cRPGs. cRPGs have matured and gotten better, but the quality of RPG adventure writing has at best stalled.
 

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TarionzCousin

Second Most Angelic Devil Ever
Couple this with the huge number of games which fade and die long before player goals are realized, it's not surprising that players have a hurry up mentality.
Agreed.

I have had the vast majority of my characters wither on the vine when the campaign ended prematurely. I would guess that most regular D&D players have had multiple campaigns end before their characters were high level.
 

oxybe

Explorer
i would say it's partially because in older editions it took forever to level up and unless you were a caster, your scope of options pretty much stayed the same.

a fighter in 2nd ed, when gaining a level hit a little bit more accurately and got more hit points. and that's it, really. some NWP/WP occasionally, but it was "hit slightly better, can take one more hit." mages, however, often looked forward to getting a better scope of options available to them. remember: level 5 allowed you to freaking FLY.

however, getting that slight attack boost or a third dimention of movement often took a long time due to the XP values needed to level up and that monsters often gave a small number of XP. in modern D&D, 3rd & up, you leveled every three or four sessions if things went as expected.

the other issue is that modern D&D does require some pre-planning. in 3rd ed you had some complex feat chains and PRCs that had requirements, so if you wanted to jump into the Master of Mastery-ness PRC as soon as possible, you needed to get your ducks in a row quickly. this meant planning several levels in advance.

part of the game has simply expanded in a way that requires or at least benefits pre-planning.

so yeah:
-martial types look forward to having their "trick" finally hit a point where it's consistently useable and getting more tricks
-mages look forward to an ever-expanding scope of options

it's not necessarily that the here and now is uninteresting, but rather the foreknowledge that the next level offers more to us in term of gameplay possibilities, modern D&D does require some pre-planning AND we can see when that next level should be coming.

as for the whole "them young'uns" attitude, there's nothing wrong with wanting a bit more gratification "right now". i'm 28 going on 29. i don't always have the time to dedicate to a game that i used to 15+ years ago, when i was whiling away the weekend-long sessions at my buddy's place and my biggest worry was "is my homework done?". getting a 4 hour session once a week going on regularly is VERY hard, when you need to coordinate 5-6 adults with different obligations. that TTRPGs are having a hard time competing with CRPGs says less about the players and more about the industry as for the most part, the dynamic of the TTRPG hasn't changed much since it's inception. the overall experience i've gotten with D&D hasn't changed since i started, but my videogames have become much, much better at giving me a good experience for my time and money.

it's fine that some people want D&D, and RPGs as a whole, to remain as it was in the 70's but when it takes months to see progress in your campaign and your character has seen little growth (or worse: having to start over because the campaign died for whatever reason), it can be frustrating. especially when i can get us 5 guys in the same room, each on our laptops/desktops, and get multiple 30-40 minute games of League of Legends on in one evening.

or do some progress on a single-player game at my own leisure.

which is frustrating for me since i like the idea, the concept of the TTRPG. the execution does not seem to be getting better with age.
 

Campbell

Relaxed Intensity
We live in a vastly more mobile society than we used to. It's not unusual for people to move every 2-3 years. Therefore trying to sell a game that is based on extended campaigns that could run in the excess of 4 years does not match up with the overall market.
 


It has been observed that 3e marks the point at which character building became a major part of gameplay, as opposed to necessary bookkeeping. The "skilled play" part of the game was less about combats and dice and more about feats and prestige classes.

If you derive a lot of enjoyment from constantly tweaking your character, getting a new level is the next exciting moment for you to anticipate.
 

Hussar

Legend
We live in a vastly more mobile society than we used to. It's not unusual for people to move every 2-3 years. Therefore trying to sell a game that is based on extended campaigns that could run in the excess of 4 years does not match up with the overall market.

And IMO never did. Even WotCs market research in the nineties pegged campaigns as typically lasting less than a year.

And that was under 2e rules where levelling typically was slowest.

The multiyear campaign model rarely actually existed. It might have been the goal but was not achieved very often.
 

Obryn

Hero
I'm pushing 40, with a family, house, and career.

I like to have some "instant" in my entertainment gratification, frankly. Levels are a big deal in D&D, and represent a shifting story as much as increased narrative control. You should stick at a level exactly as long as it's fun to do so, and not much longer.
 

billd91

Not your screen monkey (he/him)
I think the people bringing up the fact that you've got many more decision points and options available by leveling up now are right. Everybody wants their level-up cookie now and the game has developed to give it to them… and people are responding to that by wanting their cookie even more. Welcome to the behavioral conditioning feedback loop.
 

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