• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

Writer Beware? (a bit of a rant)

Yuan-Ti

First Post
Anyone ever read any biographical detail of Robert E. Howard or H.P. Lovecraft? These guys constantly got shafted by publishers... This in no way justifies how you have been treated or should make you feel any better. It just shows that the world of publishing has not changed much in 70 years.

I was thinking that revealing which companies are problems could actually open you up to litigation (for slander) unless you have proof (contract and publication). Certainly, some publishers might be tempted to retaliate if you did -- by telling others about your supposed failings as a writer, for example. What might be just as useful, however, would be a thread in which freelancers who frequent these forums list publishers they have always received timely payment from. The bad list can be somewhat extrapolated from the good list.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

DanMcS

Explorer
Yuan-Ti said:
I was thinking that revealing which companies are problems could actually open you up to litigation (for slander) unless you have proof (contract and publication). Certainly, some publishers might be tempted to retaliate if you did -- by telling others about your supposed failings as a writer, for example. What might be just as useful, however, would be a thread in which freelancers who frequent these forums list publishers they have always received timely payment from. The bad list can be somewhat extrapolated from the good list.

Since it would be in writing, it would be libel. But it's only libel if it's false, and no game publisher is going to start up a libel suit that would be way more expensive than just paying the author what they owed him.

However, if you're that worried about it, it would be more effective to say "I have submitted contracted work to companies X, Y, and Z. X and Y have always paid me on time."
 

You do not need a contract to show the existence of an agreement. You just need evidence, for which a paper trail is usually best. Emails generally suffice if they show a clear intent and a clear agreement for pay in exchange for services rendered.
 

rpghost

First Post
Hell, if you were not paid in some way for your work, then it's still yours. Release it yourself on RPGNow.com or where ever. If the publishers have a problem with that, let them fight you off instead of you begging them for decent treatment.

James
 

rpghost said:
Hell, if you were not paid in some way for your work, then it's still yours. Release it yourself on RPGNow.com or where ever. If the publishers have a problem with that, let them fight you off instead of you begging them for decent treatment.

James

Brutal, but effective. And without a contract, the publisher is up the creek.

I LIKE it!
 

PlotDevice

First Post
Indeed, if you copyright your work, the publisher might be in breach of the law by continuing to publish it. :lol:

(assuming it is not all OGL, in which case ANYONE can publish it again, really)

Evan
 

Lizard

Explorer
PlotDevice said:
Indeed, if you copyright your work, the publisher might be in breach of the law by continuing to publish it. :lol:

(assuming it is not all OGL, in which case ANYONE can publish it again, really)

Evan

Well, there's some issues here.

First, there's no need to 'copyright' work. All original work is copyright by default.

Even if it is OGL, if it was submitted to a publisher for pay, the publisher has to pay. Remember., the publisher must have the authority to RELEASE the work under the OGL, and that authority is granted by the author to the publisher on the basis of being paid. If I have a document containing material derived from the SRD on my hard disk, that does not mean you can hack into my computer, copy it, and publish it, on the grounds it is Open Gaming material. :)
 

As others have already pointed out: "congratulations, you've been cheated by a publisher! You're now officially a freelancer!"


Kamikaze Midget said:
I've had publishers start talking to me, I send them drafts, they say "Oh, we were out of town and really busy," a year later. I've got editors (admittedly, of the more small-time companies that are done as side-projects) sitting on manuscripts that aren't more than 20 pages for months. I've had things published, and haven't recieved one red cent from my own effort and investment.
Are these drafts contracted or pitches? If it's just a pitch you've not heard back on, decide upon a deadline that you'll wait until -- beyond that, consider the project lost and move on. If it's a draft for contracted work, if you're truly frustrated and want to take the work elsewhere, ask to be let out of the contract because they're not acting in good faith to get the project done in a timely manner.

I'm having a LOT of bad experiences with some publishers out there. A LOT. In the words of Space Ghost: "A Super Lot!"


and I'm not going to take anyone to court. That's just childish and petty and in the end accomplishes nothing.
No, it's not childish or petty. It's enforcing your legal rights so long as you have a contract with them. It may accomplish nothing if the company isn't large enough to withstand the suit, but that's another matter.

Have I contacted them about it? Really, would it accomplish anything? I'd rant and rave, they'd say "Okay, do you have the evidence? The reciept? The e-mail", I'd say "I knew I shouldn't have deleted those..." and then I'd be back at square one, but have pissed off some people in the process.
This makes it sound like you're not working under contract. If so, that's a very foolish thing to do. Part of being a professional in this business, be it a freelancer or publisher, is taking the proper steps to ensure both parties are as protected as possible and that includes contracts. Whether you ever choose to legally pursue a case of a broken contract and what may come of such a pursuit is another discussion, but at least a contract is one step forward beyond not having one.

Never accept someone at their word in a professional dealing and never assume that an email is binding. A good policy is no signature on the contract = no work.

I'm not being a publisher's whipping boy anymore. My stuff is *good*. It's DANG good (for the most part. :p). It's worth at least .02/word, and probably even worth 20k a year. At the very minimum, it's worth the effort, the time, the imagination I put into it. It's worth the purchase of a d20 book (say, $20/mo).
Subjectiveness aside, it's not what YOU think your work is worth that matters -- it's what the contract you've signed says your work is worth.You could indeed be as good a writer as you say, but that's not relevant at all. Skill has nothing to do with getting paid. You could be the worst writer in the market, but if you've a contract saying you'll get paid X for work Y upon condition Z, and the publisher prints Y under condition Z you should be getting paid X. There are some truly horrible writers making nice coin as freelancers while there are also amazing writers doing fan stuff for free. In the end, the quality means nothing, just the contract.

how much do you publishers value ME? Am I not worth a few hours of editing a day? Am I not worth the consideration of keeping in contact with? Am I not worth a rejection letter? Not worth a promised paycheck? Can I be ignored?
Again, this isn't the issue. The "value" you have to a typical publisher does not extend beyond their bottom line. The publishers that bother to account for the fact that writers are not just living word processors are indeed a relatively small group, so don't think of the situation in these terms -- you'll only get yourself more frustrated. Set your sites upon the terms of your agreement and that's it.

And, as a general response to your posts, YES, it is indeed your responsibility to follow up with publishers and push them to pay you when they say they will. Why? Because you most likely don't have an accountant doing it for you and so nobody will do it if you don't do it yourself. Sure, it would be wonderful if everyone always paid on time, but they don't -- in this industry and most others. If a publisher is overdue, damn skippy you should be emailing and calling him on a regular basis to get your cash. Are you worried about souring them on you? Who cares? If they take things to the point where you have to bug them that much to get the cash to begin with, are you really in that great a rush to jump in on another project?

You can also try suggesting alternative forms of payment or payment plans. That way, you're offering the publisher an "out." Offer to accept money through Paypal so they can pay on credit if they don't have cash in their account. Offer to take monthly installments because $10 a month sure sounds better to them than a single large sum. It may not be ideal, but you increase your chances of getting your cash.

Pushing a publisher to get what is contractually owed you is never wrong and be as pushy as you need to be to get what you've earned.

And my #1 suggestion to you: be proactive and do your research. Ask around about the publisher. Ask both writers and artists. Check to see if anyone else has had problems with the company. See if there's been an announcement on an independent gaming site about the publisher having financial troubles (you certainly don't want to get screwed over by their attempt to climb back from the abyss.)
 

Varianor Abroad said:
You do not need a contract to show the existence of an agreement. You just need evidence, for which a paper trail is usually best. Emails generally suffice if they show a clear intent and a clear agreement for pay in exchange for services rendered.
CAN you work without a contract? Yes.

SHOULD you work without a contract? No.

While it is possible to prove an agreement through other means, such means are much easier to disprove. For example, if I take an email into court I'll likely need to bring in the ISP's records to prove I didn't manipulate the heading information and content. Considering the email is sitting on my hard drive and not the publisher's, it would be well within my means to do so (especially considering how easy it is.) Any judge other than Judy would almost certainly require some manner of third party verification.
 
Last edited:

Steve Conan Trustrum said:
CAN you work without a contract? Yes.

SHOULD you work without a contract? No.

While it is possible to prove an agreement through other means, such means are much easier to disprove. For example, if I take an email into court I'll likely need to bring in the ISP's records to prove I didn't manipulate the heading information and content. Considering the email is sitting on my hard drive and not the publisher's, it would be well within my means to do so (especially considering how easy it is.) Any judge other than Judy would almost certainly require some manner of third party verification.

Absolutely agreed on working without a contract. Bad idea. However, I think it's counterproductive to start discussing legal specifics of proving a case. If you're down to that, better get to www.nolo.com or better yet a real lawyer. I had typed up a long example of how you could get around the above problem, but deleted it as I decided it's too much of a threadjack.

Short 'n sweet. If you did work, and didn't get paid, the other party's in violation of a contract. What you do at that point is up to you. Legally, you're entitled to collect. Proving the case? Different story. Talk to your lawyer. :)
 

Voidrunner's Codex

Remove ads

Top