D&D 5E Grappling with Mirror Image

tglassy · May 24, 2019

I've been trying to find information on this, but everyone always asks about grappling someone else who is using Mirror Image, or being grappled while using Mirror Image. I want to know how effective it would be to grapple while using Mirror Image.

So you cast Mirror Image, then you Grapple someone. Let's say you manage to shove them prone as well. My thoughts on this are that they would then have disadvantage on attacks against you, and even if they hit, you could potentially direct the attack to one of the images.

One thing I've seen people point out is that if the attacker can perceive with something other than sight, then Mirror Image has no effect, and if you're Grappling, then they are "touching" you, thereby perceiving with something other than sight, but that doesn't make sense to me. A grapple could just be grabbing someone's wrist. The Mirror Image could show four people grabbing your wrist, all moving around confusingly. Only one is actually touching you, but unless you close your eyes, you'd get confused and just start hitting.

The character I've built already has Enlarge/Reduce and Expertise in Athletics. Mirror Image has no concentration, so it can work alongside Enlarge/Reduce. I just might not be able to get War Caster, and I'm looking for ways to avoid being hit after grappling to avoid loosing Concentration.

jaelis · May 24, 2019

tglassy said:
One thing I've seen people point out is that if the attacker can perceive with something other than sight, then Mirror Image has no effect, and if you're Grappling, then they are "touching" you, thereby perceiving with something other than sight, but that doesn't make sense to me. A grapple could just be grabbing someone's wrist. The Mirror Image could show four people grabbing your wrist, all moving around confusingly. Only one is actually touching you, but unless you close your eyes, you'd get confused and just start hitting.

I would rule that since you are touching the grappled creature, it can indeed rely on a sense other than sight. But I don't think the rules are clear cut about it, so you'd have to see what your DM thinks.

Nebulous · May 24, 2019

jaelis said:
I would rule that since you are touching the grappled creature, it can indeed rely on a sense other than sight. But I don't think the rules are clear cut about it, so you'd have to see what your DM thinks.

Yeah, if you closed your eyes and fought against the only physical thing grappling you, it wouldn't matter if there were illusory fake ones. DM call though.

LordEntrails · May 24, 2019

Grappling is not just grabbing someone's wrist. Grabbing someone's wrist does not restrain them will all the penalties of the condition. You can grab someone's wrist no doubt, but that's not "grappling".

Grappling is effectively a two arm grab and nearly a hug. If their is any separation between the two bodies, it is minimal and intermittent. Meaning if you are being grappled, their is no doubt who is grappling you and where they are.

tglassy · May 24, 2019

No, all Grappling does is reduce their speed to 0, and you only need one hand to do it. Grabbing someone's wrist most certainly IS grappling. Restraining, however, is something different, and can only be done with the Grappler Feat.

jaelis · May 24, 2019

While it is true that grappling doesn't restrain, I think it is debatable whether it is as simple as grabbing someone's wrist. Arguably it would be hard to keep hold of someone if you only had them by one wrist. I usually picture it as a bit more than that.

tglassy · May 24, 2019

Regardless of how we see it, holding someone by the wrist would reduce their speed to 0. That's all Grappling does. And the fact that you can grapple as many people as you have hands. it doesn't stop them from attacks, or give them disadvantage on anything. It just stops them from moving.

LordEntrails · May 24, 2019

tglassy said:
Regardless of how we see it, holding someone by the wrist would reduce their speed to 0. That's all Grappling does. And the fact that you can grapple as many people as you have hands. it doesn't stop them from attacks, or give them disadvantage on anything. It just stops them from moving.

No it wouldn't. Hold onto my wrist and prevent me from running circles around you. Nope.

tglassy · May 24, 2019

LordEntrails said:
No it wouldn't. Hold onto my wrist and prevent me from running circles around you. Nope.

Um...yep. I'm pretty sure that's called a "Strength check to break the grapple". If I roll higher than you, I most certainly stop you from running circles around me, lol.

jaelis · May 24, 2019

tglassy said:
Um...yep. I'm pretty sure that's called a "Strength check to break the grapple". If I roll higher than you, I most certainly stop you from running circles around me, lol.

Well that's the question, does it require a Strength check to make someone let go of your wrist? Does it matter if you are using your whole body and they can only touch you with that one hand? The rules don't get into that level of detail.