What would you have done?

[Ravingdork]

Your GM was right. The stat block says that the two jellies are identical and you do not divide hitpoints after they split. So if a hit brings the opchre jelly down to 49 hitpoints and it splits, then each of the jellies has 49 hitpoints after the split. The reason for this is that the jelly is an elite monster, so allowing it to act as two monsters after it is bloodied is the sort of thing that is supposed to happen. 25/25 would have been ridiculously easy to take down.

I actually ran this encounter for my players last night, so I know whereof I speak. They wiped up the ochre jelly quickly enough. No need to make things even easier.

It really, truly says that in the module? The monster manual oozes clearly indicate that the HPs are split between the halves.

 

[77IM]

That's the thing about PUSH effects. The enemy has to be pushed AWAY from you. If we would have pushed them to the right, then they woud still be adjacent to us, which is illegal for Push effects.

Actually, the wording for push is something like, "every square into which the enemy moves must place it further away from you." So the 2nd PC from the left could have bull-rushed Jr. towards the right.

-- 77IM

 

[Tony Vargas]

They were retreating back the way the came.

 

[Wolfwood2]

It really, truly says that in the module? The monster manual oozes clearly indicate that the HPs are split between the halves.

Yes. I mean, c'mon, 25 hitpoints or less? With the way PCs can concentrate fire, I'd be lucky to get a single round where both jellies can attack. If the MM changed it (KotS being preview rules and stats, and I havne't looked at the MM entry.) than I am deeply disappointed in the MM.

 

[Khime]

It really, truly says that in the module? The monster manual oozes clearly indicate that the HPs are split between the halves.

Keep on the Shadowfell p54: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with a number of hit points equal to the ochre jelly's current hit points.

Monster Manual p202: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with hit points equal to one-half its current hit points.

Bit of a difference, that. Though the Monster Manual correction makes sense - otherwise you get an Ochre Jelly bloodied, and it suddenly becomes two creatures that, between them, have the hit points of a fully healed Ochre Jelly? Which basically means the entire combat up until that point really just inflicted no damage, doubled the number of attacks the jelly can make, and also allowed it to flank with itself? No thanks.

 

[Anthraxus]

Keep on the Shadowfell p54: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with a number of hit points equal to the ochre jelly's current hit points.

Monster Manual p202: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with hit points equal to one-half its current hit points.

Considering KotS was released a month(or so) before the Monster Manual- the Keep's version may have been the original rule, or one that just didn't get caught in playtesting/editing.

 

[Wolfwood2]

Keep on the Shadowfell p54: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with a number of hit points equal to the ochre jelly's current hit points.

Monster Manual p202: The ochre jelly splits into two, each with hit points equal to one-half its current hit points.

Bit of a difference, that. Though the Monster Manual correction makes sense - otherwise you get an Ochre Jelly bloodied, and it suddenly becomes two creatures that, between them, have the hit points of a fully healed Ochre Jelly? Which basically means the entire combat up until that point really just inflicted no damage, doubled the number of attacks the jelly can make, and also allowed it to flank with itself? No thanks.

Hitpoints aren't physical damage, remember? I think it's a fun boss monster transformation. Just when you think it's down, all of a sudden it rears up and you have to beat the new, improved version. Take it from someone who ran the KotS version, it worked pretty well. I have nothing but scorn for the MM version.

 

[Khime]

Hitpoints aren't physical damage, remember? I think it's a fun boss monster transformation. Just when you think it's down, all of a sudden it rears up and you have to beat the new, improved version. Take it from someone who ran the KotS version, it worked pretty well. I have nothing but scorn for the MM version.

That sounds like a great ability... for a Solo monster. For an Elite? Not so much. An Elite monster shouldn't have an ability that, if you bloody it, allows it to heal to full health and double its offensive output. One or the other, maybe. Not both.

 

[Ravingdork]

Actually, the wording for push is something like, "every square into which the enemy moves must place it further away from you." So the 2nd PC from the left could have bull-rushed Jr. towards the right.

-- 77IM

Good point. But please remember, the above diagram is static. In the actual game the rats were all over the place (and are probably under-represented above). Any openings we had were shut down because we didn't prepare actions in time or weren't valid options (in one instance, my gnome could have bull rushed, but it would have failed against the large creature automatically). I very seriously doubt that 6 players at the table actively looking for bull rush opportunities would have missed an opening like that.

 

[Goumindong]

[sblock]Plus, in the original KotS encounter, the Ochre Jelly is co-habiting with Giant Rats, not Dire Rats. While Dire Rats are Medium, Giant Rats are Small, making them two size categories smaller than the Large Ochre Jelly. Would that make a difference?[/sblock]Also, why can't you bull-rush an enemy through one of their allies squares? Allies can move through squares occupied by allies. And even if they were considered enemies, see my comment inside the spoiler about the "dire" rats.

You can bull rush an enemy through another enemies space, but since you can only bull rush 1 square and you cant end up occupying the same space, the push ends up not valid.

Since they were giant and not dire rats, the push would have been legal since +/- 2 size categories can occupy the same space.