D&D 4E Paladins - The first 4e class to fail

[Doctor Proctor]

Another thing that the Pally can do along those is to allow double marking with focus fire. If you have both a Fighter and a Pally in the party, they can both attack the same monster and have the Fighter mark him, while the Pally can spend his minor to mark an adjacent target. This allows for some interesting combos since both monsters are locked down but they'll take down one of them faster by both attacking the same target. That combo is not possible with two Fighters though...so it's just another little interesting dimension that the Pally adds to combat.

As Sabathius42 said, it's different...not better or worse.

 

[ppaladin123]

I should note that talk over on rpg.net about phbII has revealed that there is now a feat that lets you choose any stat other than strength for basic attacks. Essentially it is a generalization of intelligent blade master. I've seen the photos...it is confirmed.

So now the charisma-based paladin has yet another plus in his favor until Divine Power comes out.

 

[FireLance]

So now the charisma-based paladin has yet another plus in his favor until Divine Power comes out.

It still costs a feat, though, so the Strength-based paladin will have an extra edge somewhere else.

 

[Eldorian]

First off, the Charisma/wisdom/strength paladin does OK I think. Debuffs, taking hits for the team, and and heals that don't consume ally resources all defend the party, but differently than the fighter.

Has anyone tried taking each Strength based power, replacing all references to Strength with Charisma, references to Charisma or Wisdom with Strength?

And changing Lay on Hands to be Charisma times per day, with the feat Healer's Hands adding Wisdom?

Basically, any power that was Protecting becomes Charisma primary, wisdom secondary, and any power that was Avenging becomes Charisma primary, Strength secondary? I'm typing up a doc that makes every paladin a Charisma then something paladin, sorta like how warlord works. Wondering if it's been playtested, or if anyone has any thoughts here.

 

[LostSoul]

3. Against A Marked Opponent Who Makes An Attack That Does Not Include The Defender

If the Fighter has Shield Push, I think this one goes to the Fighter.

 

[Shadeydm]

It will be interesting to see if the two new builds in Divine Power will address some of the issues people percieve in the current options. That is assuming there will be two new builds of course.

 

[Kzach]

Even a Strength-based paladin with a Charisma of 14 deals 5 points of damage a round, which is comparable to the expected damage of a Strength 18 fighter with a one-handed weapon such as a longsword.

I would've thought that 8.5 isn't even remotely comparable to 5.

 

[Enforcer]

I would've thought that 8.5 isn't even remotely comparable to 5.

It is when the 5 is guaranteed and the 8.5 has to hit first.

 

[LittleFuzzy]

Yes, there is no Strength power at level 9...I know. However, I'm betting that will be fixed in Divine Power. It sucks that you have to wait awhile, but I'm sure that most DM's would give you some leeway to change one of the Charisma powers to a Strength one. Or go MC Fighter and take a 9th level Fighter Daily. Victorious Surge would be a great choice, and it's even a free heal!

The biggest problem I've always had with the "just MC" defense is what are we supposed to do if we're playing in a heroic tier campaign? When the paladin is actually 9th level and can't take the daily power-switch feat because it requires the character be 10th level. Kinda screws any LFR-compliant strength paladin, doesn't it?

 

[Nail]

The way I've seen combats go down, a defender with just a bit of healing would have been welcome. We often wish we had just one more way to activate a healing surge.