The Proper Use of Nudity in FRPG Art

[Kwalish Kid]

Why do people compare breasts to testicles

I guess you haven't seen a good pair of shorts that gives good testicleavage!

On a note more related to this thread: I don't find the change in female nudity over the years very significant, but I am glad for a big change in make adventurers. From Dragonlance through early 2E, every male adventurer was also a member of ZZ-Top.

 

[Kwalish Kid]

By comparison, would it be acceptable if Frazetta showed strong white males and females defending cowering, simpering black males and females? Would that just be 'niche protection'?

Not only this. Additionally, if almost every picture in a work, where black men and women were involved, has this theme, the work as a whole is sending a message.

Of course, in reality, there aren't really any pictures of black people in most RPG works. Perhaps this requires another thread.

 

[Barastrondo]

Bras, Bikini tops, shirts, sports tops, chainmail bikinis, and so on were invented for just such an occasion where nipples were meant to be hidden.

Well, and also because over a certain cup size, things like bras and particularly sports bras can be more practical than simply letting things go as they may, particularly with active movement. There's a reason that "lift and separate" became a phrase, and it's not because the oppressive society wouldn't let bra marketing say "hide your nipples." Art is art, but where gaming is concerned I tend to prefer illustration to titillation. The latter is far easier to find on one's own on the internet.

Me, I'm also in the camp that would just like art that's good and makes sense. Sexy revealing outfits for both genders are fine, but honestly I'd also like to see zero instances of plate armor that protects every body part but that daring splash of cleavage and, presumably, the heart and lungs you've got stored behind it. Succubi in outrageous outfits are fine, but also throw in some incubi examples of hypersexualized male perfection while you're at it.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I guess you haven't seen a good pair of shorts that gives good testicleavage!

On a note more related to this thread: I don't find the change in female nudity over the years very significant, but I am glad for a big change in make adventurers. From Dragonlance through early 2E, every male adventurer was also a member of ZZ-Top.

I am not asexual. I like good looking women. I like looking at nudity.

But... There is place for everything.
I would prefer avoiding "stupid" clothing and armor. And I don't mind if there is an "equal opportunity" thing going on. An attractive male can be someone I can "pretend" to be, just like I pretend to be an elf or a wizard.

Maybe the real trick is to allow artwork people identify with, not merely objectify. I don't want to be a helpless man in tight leather. I can't imagine women feeling any different about that.
But being attractive, strong, elegant or sexy? I think there are few who wouldn't want to be that, men and women alike.
Even scars can be cool. Where did they come from, what story do they tell? And I doubt it's all that hard for a real artist to draw scars that are "sexy". Sure, "realistic" scars might not be, but it might still be more realistic than chainmail bikinis.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I have no problem with nudity in fantasy art. Depending on the context of the individual work, nudity can be rather sexy or hilarious. The blond thief in the bikini on the cover of the 1E DMG is rather sensibly dressed when considering the environment. If she were covered head to toe in heavy leather armor in the heat of that place it would be more unbelievable.

Likewise, a woman depicted in a frozen tundra wearing only a fur swimsuit and leg warmers is funny and hard to take seriously. Such pictures can be very sexy and extremely funny at the same time. There are numerous pieces of fantasy art that make me giggle and think "that's hawt" at the same time.

To be deeply "bothered" by such things is a concept I don't understand.

 

[Umbran]

Folks,

You know the rules - no backtalk to mods in-thread. Please, avoid hyperbole, and keep things grandma-friendly.

 

[Barastrondo]

I have no problem with nudity in fantasy art. Depending on the context of the individual work, nudity can be rather sexy or hilarious. The blond thief in the bikini on the cover of the 1E DMG is rather sensibly dressed when considering the environment. If she were covered head to toe in heavy leather armor in the heat of that place it would be more unbelievable.

Yes, but in that same piece you have two men dressed head-to-toe, one in heavy cloth, one in metal armor. It's a bit of a double-standard. The artist may have been trying to depict "look, women are smarter than men because they wear bikinis to fight efreet when it's hot" — but if that's the case, he didn't do a really good job of showing her as more effective than her two (non-grabbed) friends. And I honestly doubt that was the intent.

To be deeply "bothered" by such things is a concept I don't understand.

I wouldn't say I'm deeply bothered by it, but I'm lightly bothered by the double standard. If the two guys on the cover of the DMG were also in thongs, baring their muscular buttocks for the viewer's pleasure, there are fewer people who would leap to the artist's defense out of principle. Still plenty, thankfully, but still fewer.

It's worth bearing in mind, though, that overall pop culture is just not where it was in the seventies. The local rack of fantasy novels isn't teeming with covers depicting scantily-clad barbarians and their equally scantily-clad conquests as much as it was. Things like Wheel of Time and Song of Ice and Fire and Harry Potter and Golden Compass have all done their part of changing the general fantasy zeitgeist. The LotR movies made Eowyn a more widely visible swordswoman than Red Sonja.

The original AD&D art is, in part, a product of its time. It hails back to wizards and barbarians being airbrushed on the sides of vans, and to drive-in movies that Joe Bob Briggs would rate on the number of exposed breasts. Unless the zeitgeist returns, that particular brand of nudity in game art is probably unlikely to become the norm.

 

[Lord Xtheth]

I would much prefer total nudity to a chainmail bikini. There are plenty of reasons why adventurers, male or female, might be naked. Maybe they took off their clothes to swim through a subterranean lake. Maybe they were captured and stripped of all their gear. Maybe they got in a fight with a marilith and their clothes were shredded to the point of uselessness (though in that case, they ought to be covered in sword cuts). A chainmail bikini, on the other hand, has no conceivable justification other than the erotic.

Of course, if we're going to have naked women, it's only fair to the female fans to throw in some naked men as well...

Thats kind of my point though. If the scene has naked people in it... let there be naked people in it. If you CAN'T let naked people be in the scene then don't even put people pretending to be naked in the scene.

Theres a reason that that one Natalie Portman movie where she's a stripper (But never seen naked) flopped and made no money. Because you watch stripper movies to see naked people... the same thing goes for naked people in art. Don't fake nudity to show naked people... show naked people to show naked people...

sorry for the rant... I'm just realy annoyed that the artists know they can't paint a boobie... but then paint a breast with some random thing covering it...

 

[pawsplay]

Me, I'm also in the camp that would just like art that's good and makes sense. Sexy revealing outfits for both genders are fine, but honestly I'd also like to see zero instances of plate armor that protects every body part but that daring splash of cleavage and, presumably, the heart and lungs you've got stored behind it. Succubi in outrageous outfits are fine, but also throw in some incubi examples of hypersexualized male perfection while you're at it.

"Hypersexualized male perfection." Something about that phrase just makes my day.

 

[Leatherhead]

I wonder if anyone realizes this thread is nearly a year-and-a-half old.