New D&D Website

[MrMyth]

Don't underestimate piquing interest. Indeed, that was the real reason behind having the galleries online in the first place. It wasn't to give people art to use in a game (although it certainly did that). The art, mixed with an inside look at a class, a few feats, a location, and a few monsters, were there to get people to buy physical books. Now, moving the art and the classes behind a wall of subscription shows to me that it's not as much about the books anymore, as it's about getting people onto a subscription.

That's fine and dandy. That's not me. I'm not that target demographic.

As a note, they still have many more excerpts these days for all their upcoming products (along with the art posted in the previews themselves.) It may well be they feel that stands as a strong enough preview for showing potential customers what they have to offer.

I think the art would certainly be a good supplement to those previews, but I can understand their logic, and one should acknowledge exactly how much upcoming info they share freely these days.

 

[rjdafoe]

I am sorry, but that picture is more than enough to decide if you like it or not.

Maybe it is just me, but the fury over this makes me count my blessing that I do not try and make my living in this industry.

The content of the character builder alone for the $55ish dollars I spent on a 1 year sub is worth it. And it all cost me about 1.5 books.

 

[Mercutio01]

As a note, they still have many more excerpts these days for all their upcoming products (along with the art posted in the previews themselves.)

That's news to me. I just assumed the little preview thumbnails were the same as the thumbnails for the gallery. That little tidbit leads me to re-examine my earlier critique about "all" the art going behind the wall. It's certainly not made clear that there's art associated with the excerpts.

one should acknowledge exactly how much upcoming info they share freely these days.

As compared to what? No free info? Or compared to what they used to have?

I am sorry, but that picture is more than enough to decide if you like it or not.

You really think so? Like honestly, wholeheartedly mean that you would be willing to spend $10 just to see it bigger or $40 to buy the book it's in? If so, you're much more generous with your money than I can afford to be. I honestly can't tell what that guy is, what he's holding, or what it's supposed to be illustrating.

 

[rjdafoe]

You really think so? Like honestly, wholeheartedly mean that you would be willing to spend $10 just to see it bigger or $40 to buy the book it's in? If so, you're much more generous with your money than I can afford to be. I honestly can't tell what that guy is, what he's holding, or what it's supposed to be illustrating.

Yes, it tells me wether I like the style of the art or not. There are styles I do not care for, I don't need to see the details of the art.

Also, in reality, the art is secondary to the content that is in the book. The previews of the books do way more for me than the art.

If it was an art book, I could see what you are saying, but they are not. Art is secondary to content - after all it is a game.

 

[MrMyth]

That's news to me. I just assumed the little preview thumbnails were the same as the thumbnails for the gallery. That little tidbit leads me to re-examine my earlier critique about "all" the art going behind the wall. It's certainly not made clear that there's art associated with the excerpts.

Yeah - I mean, it isn't in large quantities, but there tends to be a full-size image with every excerpt, and that does give a decent sense of the art in the book.

As compared to what? No free info? Or compared to what they used to have?

Compared to what they used to have. The build-up to 4E was really where they began the 'previews 2-3 times a week', and they have kept it going for pretty much every new product.

Previously, they mainly just had the 'In the Works' article at the start of each month that had generally one excerpt from each book in the next 2-3 months. Occasionally one or two previes here or there, but not with any consistency that I recall. Now they still have 'In the Works', plus the weekly previews - plus more previews that show up on Facebook, are shared with gamer blogs, etc. Plus the thumbnails to get a least some sense for the artwork, plus the Character Builder demo and all the Level 1-3 content in it, plus the Compendium to search for a summary of the content in any given book (how many feats, what classes/races/paragon paths/items), if not the details. (Plus even more stuff for DDI subscribers, in editorials, Ampersand, Playtest articles, Exlusive Previews, etc.)

That is an enormous devotion to sharing info on upcoming products and letting people get a sense of the product before deciding whether they want to purchase something or not.

Like I said - I think free art galleries was a stand-up move on their part and complimented the rest of their previews nicely. But I don't think it is fair to say the site isn't offering anything to non-DDI members, or that they aren't making an effort to let people 'browse before they buy'.

 

[Mercutio01]

Yeah - I mean, it isn't in large quantities, but there tends to be a full-size image with every excerpt, and that does give a decent sense of the art in the book.

With that in mind, I'll certainly amend my thoughts on moving the galleries behind the wall.

Compared to what they used to have. The build-up to 4E was really where they began the 'previews 2-3 times a week', and they have kept it going for pretty much every new product.

3E had maybe less "previews" but more articles--Characters with Class, Minds Eye, Rules of the Game, Use this Book Tonight, Vicious Venues, etc. So while there may be the same amount--or more--of preview material (which I'm not sold on), it seems to me that there is far less in the way of the other materials than there once was. "All About Sneak Attacks" is still an essential article for 3E rogues. Those articles were before Wizards took back Dungeon and Dragon, and those are the same types of articles that have been absorbed by Dungeon and Dragon, so what we used to get as support articles for free, are now part of a magazine.

 

[MrMyth]

3E had maybe less "previews" but more articles--Characters with Class, Minds Eye, Rules of the Game, Use this Book Tonight, Vicious Venues, etc. So while there may be the same amount--or more--of preview material (which I'm not sold on), it seems to me that there is far less in the way of the other materials than there once was.

This is certainly true (though really a different topic from what is at hand, in a lot of ways.)

But... in absolute honesty, many of those articles - the columns, the web enhancements - were generally not up to par in terms of quality. Some were great... many were unusable. I truly prefer paying money for them, and in return, having them be of the same quality of the rest of their products. Which, generally, they have been - occasional problem elements slip through, just like in their printed books. But those tend to be rare, and they do make the effort to later correct them.

I mean, it is always going to be a tricky situation when you previously gave something away for free, and stop doing so - and then offer something similar for sale. But the key question is simply whether the product they are offering is worth the price for it - if so, then it is a worthwhile product. If you don't feel it is worth the price, and did enjoy it as a free product... well, that is a shame. But it was free, right? One should be grateful for the free stuff one got, rather than retain the expectation that they are 'owed' that free stuff for all time to come...

 

[Mercutio01]

If you don't feel it is worth the price, and did enjoy it as a free product... well, that is a shame. But it was free, right?

I don't feel that preview content should be paid for. That's like charging admission to an art gallery and having it consist of pictures of paintings rather than the paintings themselves.

rather than retain the expectation that they are 'owed' that free stuff for all time to come...

People keep throwing that word out there, and even including it in quotes, as if to say that I actually said that. Please stop putting words in my mouth or pretending to have any idea what's inside my head beyond what I've said.

I noted that policy was nearly 10 years long with respect to the art galleries (which are incidentally NOT the art itself, but merely small, low quality copies), and that removing them to behind a paid subscription wall was a bad business decision. I cited direct examples based on my purchasing history and noted that the art plays a significant part in determining whether I'll buy an RPG product or not.

I think it stiffs longtime customers who, rightly or wrongly, over 9+ years have grown accustomed to being able to browse through the art galleries, and delivers nothing to paid subscribers that they weren't already getting. The galleries were the "preview" material I visited the Wizards website for. Removing them has removed my need to surf there (although it has been pointed out that the previews themselves have art, which was not very well advertised), and is just the latest in a series of disappointing decisions that have been made by Wizards since DDI was announced. It was the figurative straw for me, and as such I feel like I'll take my business elsewhere. Like here for instance. Soon as I can get some money into my PayPal account, I'll be buying a CSA for ENWorld. Wizards' loss is Morrus' gain.

 

[abhorsen950]

Tbh IMO its really quite nice

 

[rjdafoe]

well advertised), and is just the latest in a series of disappointing decisions that have been made by Wizards since DDI was announced. It was the figurative straw for me, and as such I feel like I'll take my business elsewhere. Like here for instance. Soon as I can get some money into my PayPal account, I'll be buying a CSA for ENWorld. Wizards' loss is Morrus' gain.

It doesn't stiff anyone, policies change over time, even long standing ones. While some people may not like it, no one can ever plan on everything being available the way it was, just becuase that is the way it was in the past.

That is too bad, as you will miss out on alot of good stuff.

I suggest you look at the previews going forward to see if you like what is coming out.

Going back to the website design. I like it alot. Much better than before. My only problem is it is not usefull to me at work any longer. We are still stuck at IE6 - while old, it is still around.

Has anyone looked at the site on cellphones and that kind of thing yet?