Alternatives to Dungeon Tiles?

[Steel_Wind]

I would point out that LCD and DLP projectors are VERY cheap right now guys. You can get a used one on eBay for $200-$300 in most auctions. Some of them less than that even at a Buy it Now price. Projector technology has now become very cheap to use at the gaming table.

That may be considerably more than you want to spend in contrast to, say, gaming paper or a standard battlemat. Point is, it's no longer the $600-$1200 investment it once was and it's well within reach of any gamer with a job who wants one.

FWIW, I'm strongly considering adding a second XGA projector for use in my new gaming room. That will give us 2048x768 resolution at the table, supporting a high resolution and more or less seamless map of about 62" x 30" at the tbale. That's MORE than enough pixels and table real estate.

You simply use a video card which supports dual monitor outputs, and use windows default monitor extensions to just move the image from one monitor to the next. Most laptops do not support dual monitor outputs, however, so if you don't have a desktop to use for the task, that can be a potential fly in the ointment if you wanted to run two projectors.

To support one projector - just about any machine or laptop will do.

Still, it's not expensive to get a machine capable of running your gaming tabletop software. An old otherwise almost unusable machine is more than adequate for the task. My guess is that most posters on ENWorld probably have an older desktop in their closet that could be pressed into service and do the job very well.

And yes, if you had a mind to, you could easily pick up a 42" inch widescreen LCD TV for $500 or so and install it directly into the top of your gaming table. Put a sheet of plexiglass over it if you like to ensure it is flush with the tabletop surface. This approach seemed a tad nutty a few years back. Right now? Totally doable - and for less money than most of us spent on projectors a few years ago.

The times they are a changing...

 

[Kimyou]

I've been using Chessex mats forever. I own 3 (2 large ones and a small one, too lazy to get the exact dimensions) and have been using them for... what... 5 years, maybe more? Chessex makes mats that will outlast most living beings, I swear.

 

[Mistwell]

While we're on the subject of free stuff, I did a post a while back about using paint swatches from places like Home Depot to grid up and use for conditions. Basically going from this...

So many colors to choose from

That is genius, and an idea I shall happily borrow.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Steel Wind, what do you use for software though? How long does it take to generate a session's worth of maps (3-4 encounters)?

Right now, I don't use software and just use gridded paper and translate to Tact-Tiles.

 

[Steel_Wind]

Steel Wind, what do you use for software though? How long does it take to generate a session's worth of maps (3-4 encounters)?

Right now, I don't use software and just use gridded paper and translate to Tact-Tiles.

This was discussed long ago on a thread I started here on ENWorld that made the front page of Slashdot back in 2005.

My preference for creating maps depends upon the type of map and nature of the setting.

If it's a pregenerated map, I scan that from a print product or use a Player's version of the map without labels, preferably. Paizo tends to post those online in the past (for Dungeon mag), They have variants of those in the electronic copy of the Pathfinder books, too.

I use a freeware software tool called Tabletop Mapper
that will reveal room on that map selectively as the doors are opened. You can get the same effect using Photoshop and suing an erasable mask layer, if you like. You can also get this effect from using something like Fantasy Grounds I or II. But Tabletop Mapper does this for you for free, without and muckety muck -- and, did I mention it's free? It does take about 3-5 minutes to mask and detail the mask later in Tabletop mapper. (It's *stupid* easy to use though. If you can play Tetris, you can use Tabletop Mapper)

But that's for displaying interior maps that are pre-generated. For general purpose use, I prefer to use the original NeverwinterNights 1 to create my maps. I will use hakpaks with that game software, especially those that have buildings created for placement on the map as placeables (as opposed to putting them down as "tiles").

To be clear - you are creating and displaying the map for display on your tabletop from the NWN 1 toolset window, not for display in the NWN1 game client. This allows you to zoom out and arbitrarily move around your map on the tabletop - something you could not do in the game client.

The reason for preferring NWN1 to create my maps is:

1) it's cheap
2) it's extremely fast to use with very low system requirements
3) it looks pretty damn good when viewed directly overhead (or 5 degrees off vertical)

In NWN1, when I want to avoid a "grid" feel to the map, I place my buildings down as "placeables" and not as tile features. In NWN1, making maps like this could create all manner of walkmesh issues which made the module very buggy to play as a computer game. But we don't make a module in the toolset that has to work as a computer game. We are just making a level map for display in the NWN editor in order to be projected onto the tabletop. It only has to look good. It doesn't have to "work" as a bug free computerized playable module.

For our purposes (because we do not have to use the map as a game - just as a map) it's perfect. A placeable may be put anywhere and rotated in any arbitrary direction. This means that you are not tied to the grid system that NWN 1 forced upon map creators. You put down your stuff arbitrarily anywhere you like. Bing-bam-boom. You are done.

There is simply a VAST amount of community material for NWN1. Staggering in size, really. The selection and customizability puts something like Dundjinni to shame. Plus, where Dundjinni takes hours to create a map - I can do it in minutes.

I can, in all seriousness, put together a random outdoor map or interior map for that matter, from a blank screen to a fully detailed map with river, forests, trees, campfire and tents, horse lines, rocks, battlefield, graveyard, Walls, ruins, Castle walls, etc... in about TWO MINUTES Flat. Four minutes if I'm taking a LONG time to do it.

That is not an exaggeration. Two minutes. And it's a better battlemap-in-use than anything published in any print product available for purchase just about anywhere.

The cost of NWN1 now is woefully small. You can probably find NWN Platinum for $10 or less. You may well already have it sitting on your shelf. ("Free" is the best cost there is).

NWN2 will work as well for these purpose - but it takes longer to work with it and it has higher system requirements which not every laptop may be able to deal with. The NWN2 maps look better from various angles and if lighting were n issue, the lighting engine in NWN2 is better, sure.

But the maps, for tabletop RPG purposes, are not significantly improved when viewed directly overhead or 5 degrees off overhead (I like to use a wee bit of perspective).

You cna do some really cool things with NWN1 and a projector. I can add animated fire to my map. I can literally put down walls of flame and have a lava field that gurgles and spits lava. It's...well....it totally rocks.

Because of the extra time it takes to create a map in NWN2 over NWN1, I prefer NWN1 to use to create my maps, generally speaking.

The art selection for a SciFi or modern setting game when using NWN1 is not as good as it is for a high fantasy RPG setting of course, but there are some SF and D20 Modern hakpaks and tilesets that work reasonably well for our purposes.

 

[buddhafrog]

Weem -- paint swatches -- brilliant! I will do this as well.

 

[Krensky]

I also have some of the Paizo flip mats and they work great too, but the creases in the fold up maps sometimes cause some some issues with minis tipping over.

I have a few blank and patterned flip maps. They work great, and you solve the crease issue by folding them opposite ways several times when you first get them and then alternating folds each time you use them.

 

[samursus]

I'll also add my appreciation of the Paizo flip mat. I heard about from a forum post and the price was so that I could afford 3 or 4 (or more) of these compared to a Chessex mat. I was a bit skeptical when I opened it up, but after 2 sessions of use I am loving its portability, durability and general budget awesomeness! I bought only the blank mat, finding the replayability of the theme mats to be too forced for my tastes.

 

[Zaukrie]

I love 3D terrain. It never matches the pre-made adventures I use, but so what? I just change it up. At some point (sacrilege for some of you, I know) reality doesn't matter....

One thing I've done is make a large board with grid on it (flocked, or painted - I have both). Then I make walls that can be placed on there. That way, I can make any size room I want.

I use lego pieces, dungeon tiles, pre-printed maps from DDM, lots of things.

I'll be posting pictures of helm's deep and a waterfall project my son and I just finished soon. We are going to build 1-2 ships next, so I can run an adventure that starts with airships....

Fat dragon games and worldworks are both great (and for 2D, you can't go wrong with 0one or skelentonkeygames). There are so many options out there, it is unreal how much more visual we can make our games now than when I started playing....

The key to me is just not worrying about making the maps match the drawings, and to letting the shapes I have form the concepts I create/use.

 

[BruntFCA]

I just love the pic with the 3D cardboard and those candles!

For anyone interested in making a digital tabletop this guy has posted complete instructions and a video. I may just go down the LCD route however.

Build Your Own Portable Digital Map for Tabletop Role Playing (Dungeons & Dragons, Pathfinder, DDM, Etc).

Cool post by the chap talking about using NWN. I just fired up NWN2, you can make some cool looking things in 3D, however I found it "unwieldy" and cumbersome from top down...graphics looked meh, and I could not find a way to make a quick preview in the tool.

In NWN2 at least it looks as if you need to "bake" the file and view it in the game; I'd like to be proven wrong since some of the effects are truly amazing. I was making fields with 3D snowfall!

Gonna hunt for those NWN1 CDs now....arrghhh!