Open Letter to WotC from Chris Dias

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They have their own online store. It sells DDI subscriptions and they don't sell anyone else's products.

I don't think we're in disagreement here, but I think that expecting WotC to open a general RPG store like Paizo's is a bit much. That's a whole new area of business. Paizo and DTRPG/RPGNow got in there early and are doing very well out of it.

Opening a general RPG store is not WotC area of expertise; and the market is pretty much dominated by Paizo and DTRPG/RPGNow already.

Paizo is an online vendor, and has been for ages, in addition to its publishing work. WotC is a just a publisher, albeit a large one.
 

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I think the difference is, you have experience with both systems. Those of us who never played 4E would be fighting rules ignorance while trying to translate.

I think story ideas, NPC's, etc would be easy to grab. I do it all the time from my old Dungeon mags. I still read them despite not playe 3e anymore. Paizo's NPC's are very well developed and I find it a huge time saver. I've grabbed some stuff from WotBS even if I don't likely plan to run it from start to finish.

Oh, and maps. Maps are always great to have, even if you can't use the encounter they're built for.

What renau1g said, except that I do grab the entire story arcs. Story arcs are edition neutral as far as I'm concerned, so I won't pass up what sounds like a well-written one just because I am unfamiliar with the ruleset. You only need know the rules you are playing in and adapt as needed.

Of course, all of that goes out of the window if the adventure is really awesome though.

This is what I was trying to say.

Snarky or serious?

A lot of both. :)

Actually it is the main reason I stopped playing 3E. I was having to "convert" modules written for 3E because they were too easy or too difficult for my group. Normally I would call this "adapting," but the amount of time I spent "adapting" modules written for 3E for my 3E game is much greater than the time it takes me to "convert" a 3E module to 4E.
 


Actually it is the main reason I stopped playing 3E. I was having to "convert" modules written for 3E because they were too easy or too difficult for my group. Normally I would call this "adapting," but the amount of time I spent "adapting" modules written for 3E for my 3E game is much greater than the time it takes me to "convert" a 3E module to 4E.

*shrug* I find converting for 3e to be pretty easy, generally speaking.

The catch, and why your snarkiness only makes you look bad given the reason you espoused, was already mentioned.

I know virtually nothing of 4e, so I'd have to learn it first in order to properly translate.

That doesn't mean that adapting/converting/translating (or using whatever euphamism makes you look better) is as hard, less hard, or harder than doing the same for 4e.

Simply that for me it's a non sequitor.

Somewhat odd, really, when up until this point, I don't think any of us have actually sniped the other's system of choice.

And you say you only need to know story arcs and you may be right, although if that boils down to a page of text per module, then it's a waste of money.

If, as Morrus and others indicate, it's substantially more work due to the different inherent assumptions made in both systems (such as when Fly is available), then there's more work than merely grabbing the arc.

Else, I'm at the point I always am - not buying an adventure because I can do it myself.

so the tl;dr version: Good job, you were snarky because you still equate being right with "winning". The fact that you weren't right to begin with changes nothing.
 


Actually it is the main reason I stopped playing 3E. I was having to "convert" modules written for 3E because they were too easy or too difficult for my group. Normally I would call this "adapting," but the amount of time I spent "adapting" modules written for 3E for my 3E game is much greater than the time it takes me to "convert" a 3E module to 4E.
*Shrug* I was able to convert on the fly - generally by not bothering. The differences were minor enough to pretty much ignore.

Time taken: zero. It is very hard to get a shorter time than that.

I really never saw the changes between 3 and 3.5 as being all that massive. I did see people blowing the changes out of proportion though.

The Auld Grump
 

*shrug* I find converting for 3e to be pretty easy, generally speaking.

What are you converting, if I may ask? We know it's not 4E modules, as you won't even look at them.

The catch, and why your snarkiness only makes you look bad given the reason you espoused, was already mentioned.

I know virtually nothing of 4e, so I'd have to learn it first in order to properly translate.

"Properly" is certainly subjective. I can understand that you may not be able to convert a 4E module to your satisfaction. My main point wasn't "BUY STUFF FROM MY EDITION!" It was that you should not ignore material entirely from a company with a reputation for good work (like Paizo or ENWorld) simply because it doesn't fit your edition of choice. For example, I can't think of one WotC 4E module I would recommend to someone for conversion to any other game.

That doesn't mean that adapting/converting/translating (or using whatever euphamism makes you look better) is as hard, less hard, or harder than doing the same for 4e.

Simply that for me it's a non sequitor.

I thought I was clear that it was an issue for me. If you want to imply that I was applying my mileage to anyone else, you are mistaken.

Somewhat odd, really, when up until this point, I don't think any of us have actually sniped the other's system of choice.

What's really odd is that you would bring up the Edition War Defense when I didn't attack any edition. I espoused the support I give Paizo in buying their adventure paths and using them in the edition of my choice. I agreed with you jokingly about the "bother" it is to convert, which apparently isn't a bother anymore because it's so easy for you. And I stated why *I* stopped playing your edition of choice. There was no intent to snipe anyone's game of choice. Obviously there was some humor that missed its mark, but that is the danger of comedy, especially in gaming. Because. Gaming. Is. Serious. Business.

And you say you only need to know story arcs and you may be right, although if that boils down to a page of text per module, then it's a waste of money.

I'm sure the writers at Paizo and here at ENWorld would love to hear that enrious thinks their creativity is a waste of money. That's the most important part of any adventure to me, the creative ideas the writers come up with. Adapting the crunch is the easy part compared to that, even for me in 3E.

If, as Morrus and others indicate, it's substantially more work due to the different inherent assumptions made in both systems (such as when Fly is available), then there's more work than merely grabbing the arc.

There is validity to what Morrus and others have said. And those concerns lie on the side of the system you *are* using, IMO, not the game you are converting from.

Else, I'm at the point I always am - not buying an adventure because I can do it myself.

If you can do something as creative as War of the Burning Sky (which I've enjoyed as a player), Rise of the Runelords, Council of Thieves, etc., please, please, please get a job with ENWorld or Paizo, or start your own company. Then I would buy what your selling too.

so the tl;dr version: Good job, you were snarky because you still equate being right with "winning". The fact that you weren't right to begin with changes nothing.

Wasn't trying to win or be right, so I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm just sharing my opinions and personal experiences as people are wont to do on a message board.

Well, yeah. And I'm sure you've missed out on some awesome cricket tournaments.

I'm sure I haven't. Nor have I missed any interesting futbol games. This is all in my personal opinion, of course. Please don't riot.
 

*Shrug* I was able to convert on the fly - generally by not bothering. The differences were minor enough to pretty much ignore.

Time taken: zero. It is very hard to get a shorter time than that.

I really never saw the changes between 3 and 3.5 as being all that massive. I did see people blowing the changes out of proportion though.

The Auld Grump

Nor I. Any adapting of 3.0, 3.5, or even Pathfinder stuff for my 3.5 or Pathfinder games have been done on the fly. Pun intended.
 

*Shrug* I was able to convert on the fly - generally by not bothering. The differences were minor enough to pretty much ignore.

Time taken: zero. It is very hard to get a shorter time than that.

I really never saw the changes between 3 and 3.5 as being all that massive. I did see people blowing the changes out of proportion though.

The Auld Grump

I've never been able to run on the fly with D&D for some reason. I could do it with my eyes closed running Shadowrun though.

My problems compounded from my personal preferences. I *love* options. The more new options available the giddier I would get. The problem with those new options in 3E in the hands of my system masters was that they could create REALLY powerful characters. This wouldn't be a problem if my entire table was filled with system masters. The power gap between them and the rest of the group kept creeping toward the point where I felt like we were playing Rifts. The system masters had Mega-damage armor and weapons, while the rest of the group did not. To challenge the system masters spelled death for the rest. To challenge the rest lead to cake-walks dominated by the system masters. Neither way were the majority of the group having fun. And I wasn't having fun trying to balance such a wide gap. This isn't an edition war thing to me. I was ready to quit 3E before 4E was ever announced.
 

Just to clarify a few points with the original letter:

I mention that the sales of 3PP PF and 3PP 4E appears to indicate that sales for 3PP PF is greater, given the number of companies shifting away from 4E. At no point did the letter state that the sales of either of the franchises was greater than the other.

I mention both the GSL forum and the Partnership page. I value them both; I was only hoping WOTC could go a bit further to stave the migration of 3PP companies, which I still insist is in Wizard's interest (market share, sales, blah blah).

In the one case, if Wizards does classify us as a "partners", that does shift the arugment more to aiding these companies over ignoring them.

But look, I was trying to encourage a dialogue with the public an WOTC and offer suggestions that I thought would work, helping Wizards as much as it helps us (helps us more, I admit, but if it helps them even a tiny bit, it can justify the effort). It wasn't my intent to fuel the conflict about which was the better system. It wasn't my intent to appear lazy or ignorant to the situation. I got three book coming at least this year regardless of any response from WOTC. I never said I hated Paizo or Pathfinder. I have no experience with them whatsoever.

Maybe Jerry Holkins is right; maybe I am the black goat with a thousand young. :) :)
 

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