Mearls' Legends and Lore - poll on delve format for adventures

[Jhaelen]

I still prefer the delve format for presenting (significant) encounters. The only change I'd like to see: WotC adventure modules come with two books: One containing the encounters and one containing the adventure overview. The latter needs to become the more important one.

I'm imagining something like the 'Hammerfast' supplement. It only has, what, 32 pages? But it's sufficient to spawn a whole (short) campaign.

The encounter book only needs to detail large set-piece encounters. Add a bunch of 'random' encounter areas that you can populate with monsters taken from 'random' encounter tables.

Both has been done before in WotC products:
In 3e it was 'Expedition to Castle Greyhawk', in 4e it was 'The Slaying Stone'.

 

[Baumi]

I still prefer the delve format for presenting (significant) encounters. The only change I'd like to see: WotC adventure modules come with two books: One containing the encounters and one containing the adventure overview. The latter needs to become the more important one.

I'm imagining something like the 'Hammerfast' supplement. It only has, what, 32 pages? But it's sufficient to spawn a whole (short) campaign.

The encounter book only needs to detail large set-piece encounters. Add a bunch of 'random' encounter areas that you can populate with monsters taken from 'random' encounter tables.

Both has been done before in WotC products:
In 3e it was 'Expedition to Castle Greyhawk', in 4e it was 'The Slaying Stone'.

The whole H1-E3 Series did that and it also had an extra map or two.

 

[FireLance]

I think the delve format is great for describing encounters. However, when it comes to describing adventures, you need more than a series of delves. I agree with those who have said that there needs to be another format for this.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I think the delve format is great for describing encounters. However, when it comes to describing adventures, you need more than a series of delves. I agree with those who have said that there needs to be another format for this.

Yarp.

Adventures need more flexibility. A given encounter might not take place in a specific place and time. The delve format presupposes too much in the setup.

 

[Jhaelen]

The whole H1-E3 Series did that and it also had an extra map or two.

Ah, no, they totally didn't! (or are you just referring to the bit about random encounters?)

Instead you get a flimsy adventure book (with maps, new monsters and magic items taking up most space) and a bigger book of about thirty encounters.

I want a flimsy encounter book detailing at most 8-10 encounters and a bigger adventure books that covers the surrounding area, adventure hooks, npcs and detailed descriptions of the adventure locales.

To me, it's not a matter of principle, it's a matter of degrees:
Just like adding a pound of salt to your meal will turn it into something that is unpalatable adding three dozen combat encounters to an adventure that can be described on a double page is too much.

The delve format itself is fine, it's just overused to the point of replacing everything
- including the actual adventure.

 

[MrMyth]

Delves have their place. They're borked by being so tied to the "boardgame" format with the dungeon tiles that they kind of grind everything down.

In an adventure that focuses on "choice," delves are not as welcome as they are when you're bored and you need a quick goblin encounter (or whatever).

Er... I think this may be confusing the question of the delve format with delve adventures. At least, as I understand it.

A delve is a short, brief adventure, usually a handful of encounters in a specific locale.

The delve format is the process of including the stats for encounters in their own location. So that, in theory, you have one page describing the adventure, and when the party engages in a combat, you can open up a second book and quickly flip to that encounter in order to have the information presented in a nice and easy fashion.

In my mind, it is good in theory. The danger is that it encourages rigid encounter design - rather than putting a bunch of monsters in a dungeon and seeing when the PCs encounter them (and thus possibly having a patrol show up as part of one fight, or in the middle of another), you instead have Specific Fight A, Specific Fight B, Specific Patrol C, etc.

For myself, though, I don't think removing the delve format is actually the answer. I think preserving that seperation of stats from adventure is a useful tool. They just need to focus more on the other half of the content - the adventure portion itself. Include guideliens on how encounters can be adjusted or how things can change based on player choice. Have the quick stats available but not the end-all and be-all.

I want to see adventure design become more robust, absolutely - but I don't want to see it come at the cost of ease of use. I think there is a happy medium to be found - I'd be a fan of a new format that preserves the merits of the delve format while finding a way to overcome its weaknesses.

 

[mhensley]

Kill it with fire. It's more work to read thru encounters than it is to make them up from scratch myself.

 

[Alzrius]

The delve format is so horrible. I've hated it ever since I first saw it.

It increases page-flipping in a game, which I already work to actively minimize. Worse, however, is that the standardized two-page format artificially inflates or condenses all encounters to a specific size. That is drastically limiting if you want a very simple or more complex encounter.

One size does not fit all. Down with delves!

 

[Dannager]

It would be cool to start seeing suggestions (and I mean actual suggestions) on a layout replacement for the delve format from those who dislike it.

What would you like to see instead?

Answers I'm looking for are not "I want a layout that focuses more on the adventure." Instead, how about "Here is what I would like the next format of adventure layout to look like:" and then describe what it looks like.

 

[Alzrius]

It would be cool to start seeing suggestions (and I mean actual suggestions) on a layout replacement for the delve format from those who dislike it.

What would you like to see instead?

Answers I'm looking for are not "I want a layout that focuses more on the adventure." Instead, how about "Here is what I would like the next format of adventure layout to look like:" and then describe what it looks like.

Here is what I would like the next format of adventure layout to look like: the way it was before - with no artificial distinction between the encounter and the rest of the adventure. That's my suggestion.