13 kinds of warlocks? Why?

[On Puget Sound]

It's not that there are so many warlocks, it's that there really aren't. If there were 13 different kinds of pacts, that would actually be pretty awesome. But having a star pact warlock, then making a star pact hexblade warlock, then deciding to make binders... "hmm, we need pacts...I know, let's make a star pact binder warlock!". Sort of like the hunter ranger and the ranger (hunter). Just enough difference to be confusing, and just enough sameness to make me wonder why they bother designing new subclasses and not making them NEW subclasses.

 

[WalterKovacs]

Also, the way that hexblades and binders work, even if the dark pact was changed to a gloom pact, there wouldn't be any support (there are no feats that require the gloom pact, and the binder's gloom pact riders specify binder, so it wouldn't work for the cursing warlocks anyway. It would give the gloom pact guys some of the dark pact stuff (utilities and dailies with riders), and there are paragon paths (although, the difference between the pact boons and other class features would make most of the paragon paths specific to one close to useless for others.

 

[DracoSuave]

Meh, there's only three types of warlocks. Ranged blaster, ranged controller, and melee beater. Everything else is just what happens when you kill a guy. The differences aren't -that- big.

And Dark pact <> Gloom pact.

Dark pact centers around sadism, and on using your allies' hit points as an extra resource to deal damage. Gloom pact is around using concealment and darkness as a foil to your enemies plans. They aren't alike at all.

 

[Kinneus]

Because after 13 iterations, they still can't make one that's a halfway decent striker.

*dodges a tomato*

 

[DracoSuave]

Because after 13 iterations, they still can't make one that's a halfway decent striker.

*dodges a tomato*

Hexblades are the only class that can benefit from Dual Implement Sorcery AND IWoP.

Go fey pact, take arcane implement proficiency light blade, use a subtle weapon as your implement, making a subtle weapon in your off hand... that's also an implement, copying both properties so that you get the benefits of subtle twice on the same power, one from the weapon keyword of the hex blade, and once from the implement keyword of the original. Those three feats and a +2 weapon will add +5 damage to pretty much everything you do, not counting your enhancement bonus, Dex modifier, IAoP.... toss in Light Blade Expertise for even more...

 

[Peraion Graufalke]

Ranger: Two-Weapon, Archer, Beastmaster, Throw-and-Stab, Scout, Hunter.

Throw-and-Stab is called a Marauder, and there's a second, earlier Hunter (MP2).

Wizard: Arcanist, Mage.

It's more like:
Arcanist/Orb of Deception, Arcanist/Orb of Imposition, Arcanist/Staff of Defense, Arcanist/Tome of Binding, Arcanist/Tome of Readiness, Arcanist/Wand of Accuracy, Mage/Enchantment, Mage/Evocation, Mage/Illusion, Mage/Necromancy, Mage/Nethermancy, Mage/Pyromancy.
Mage/Transmutation is incomplete at the moment.

/nitpick

 

[I'm A Banana]

Arcanist/Orb of Deception, Arcanist/Orb of Imposition, Arcanist/Staff of Defense, Arcanist/Tome of Binding, Arcanist/Tome of Readiness, Arcanist/Wand of Accuracy, Mage/Enchantment, Mage/Evocation, Mage/Illusion, Mage/Necromancy, Mage/Nethermancy, Mage/Pyromancy.

Ah, then you have Weaponmaster/Hammers and Weaponmaster/Axes and Weaponmaster/Swords and Weaponmaster/Spears and Weaponmaster/Maces and Weaponmaster/Flails and Weaponmaster/Thrown...and Tempests and Brawlers and Battleragers and Knights and Slayers and....

Oh, and Beastmaster/Snakemaster and Beastmaster/Wolfmaster and Beastmaster/Birdmaster and...

Never too many martial classes, oh no....

I don't personally think quantity is a major problem, here. The mechanical effects are pretty light ("build-centric powers" aside), and you can ignore what you're not currently using. I do think the game maybe needs a good way to distinguish between the options at a glance (the difference between Dark and Gloom, forex), but that's a visual design problem, not really a game design problem.

The bigger problem is that there's some pretty wildly varying quality between all these builds. A Monkeymaster Ranger and a Fey Pact Warlock and an Orb of Imposition Wizard and a Swordmaster Fighter and an Inspiring Warlord all have very different levels of support, and there's no way to know before you build it that, say, your Horsemaster Ranger won't have as many interesting options as your Battlerager Fighter.

Besides, 13 is probably exactly the right number for Warlock builds.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Besides, 13 is probably exactly the right number for Warlock builds

You're probably right about that, but an argument could be made for another 653.

(Not a very good one, though. )

 

[jonesy]

You're probably right about that, but an argument could be made for another 653.

(Not a very good one, though. )

A nation of warlocks, where every family has to have a copyright for their own way of fighting?

 

[I'm A Banana]

A nation of warlocks, where every family has to have a copyright for their own way of fighting?

Bael Turath?

In fact: The Thirteen Noble Houses of Bael Turath, thirteen prominent families whose influence extended across the damned kingdom, though their souls belonged not to this world. Each was under the auspices of a Zodiac God, the Twelve Monsters (and the hidden Thirteenth) ruling over their arcane empire as it waged a constant war with Arkhosia....

Hahahaha