If Hasbro Pulls the Plug....

I get the feeling that KenzerCo would want nothing to do with any kind of 4e clone. They are working very hard on HackMaster, with the published results looking amazing.

the stuff from Kenzer looks great. However, my group had zero interest in playing a game based on 1E/2E D&D, despite being a group of mostly old-timers like me (gaming for 30+ years)

We don't really love 4E, but we play it as the lesser evil between 4E/3.5 and Pathfinder.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Pathfinder is a good game, and has a strong following among gamers, but I still think it has only a pittience of the brand recognition D&D has. Not really surprising, but for non gamers, Paizo has a long way to go to be as well known as D&D.

Absolutely. And D&D had better have better recognition! 37 years of history compared with four! That's why WotC is continually trying to use the strength of the brand to sell non-RPG stuff, such as board games, novels, etc.

I would like to see what Paizo could do with their own game system, but the smart move for them is to not change. At least not yet.

Paizo could probably come up with a very good game. But, as with 4E, if they stray from what D&D was (and now Pathfinder *is*), they risk losing a sizable portion of their audience.
 

Indeed. How you roll out a new edition is almost as important as what changes you make.

This is a very accurate observation. I think that the attitude is a big part of bringing people on-board ("we're trying to make a product that you want to buy") or in keeping them away from the new product ("we're fixing this boring, clunky, out-dated game that you've loved playing for years on end, and we're trying to attract new players to the hobby while we're at it"). Presentation is a big part of coming across as sincere as opposed to condescending.

However, it is perhaps worth noting that the result of the PF playtest was generally that proposed changes were rolled back. This does suggest that Paizo might well find themselves unable to do much by way of a second edition.

I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. I've realized as I get older that I don't need a new system--I've got one that works, I've played it enough to iron out the kinks and rough spots, and I've had enough time to tinker with it to make the exact sort of game that I want to run. I'd be satisfied with a Pathfinder 2E that incorporated the errata from previous printings, maybe cleaned up the presentation, and included some of the best supplemental content into the core rules.

For example, a Pathfinder 2E that split into the more traditional 3-book format could put character traits all the classes from the Advanced Player's Guide and the Ultimate books in the core Player's Handbook, and put the optional systems in the Game Master's Guide (things like word magic, hero points, and so forth). Something like that would be cool.

Still, the thing that matters most is whether or not people would buy it. If people keep buying the current version of the game, there's no real incentive to update to a new edition.
 


Honestly, I wouldn't care.

I'd probably find out here on the boards, and I might post on it or read news stories out of interest, but it wouldn't affect me at all. My gaming product needs are fulfilled. The effects on the industry would probably be a significant bump to all the other companies, and various opportunistic businesses trying to find a way to catch all their customers (which, while not enough for Hasbro in this hypothetical scenario, are plenty enough to attract attention). Dragon Age would probably do great, as would PF and a number of other fantasy rpgs.

It might even be good for the hobby to distance itself from the name 'Dungeons and Dragons' which has brand recognition but also many negative connotations.

I suspect I'm not the only one who just doesn't care at this point.

+1 to this in pretty much all respects.
 

No offense to 4E fans who wouldn't switch but I think PF fans would prefer not having 4E fans switch and begin demanding 4E-like elements be added to PF.

I apparently need to spread around XP, but a big honking' "+1" to the sentiment above.

(And I don't advocate putting PF elements into 4e, either, FWIW.)
 

One does not become the new 800lb gorilla of the marketplace simply because the old 800lb gorilla is gone. One must have market share, power, and recognition, history- IOW, it has to be earned. D&D isn't just a game, it's a name...one synonymous with the industry to most outsiders.

Even if Paizo became the undisputed front runner in the RPG industry after D&D got shelved, it would be an open question of whether it was truly the 800lb gorilla...or a 400lb gorilla in a slightly less culturally relevant niche hobby market.

400 or 800 pounds, as the market leader, Paizo would definitely become the target of internet trolls worldwide. It's just the nature of the beast, you could say. ;)
 

All the crew still manning that ship - and all those aboard her sister ship PF - disagree with you. They have not sailed off the edge of the world. Their 3 hour tours of the harbor still sell tickets.

You cut to the quick, sir. 3e has sailed for WotC, something many of us agree with. It's not a slight on your edition of choice. I was simply prefacing my comment about WotC building on the current edition fan base, whom they still have.
 

400 or 800 pounds, as the market leader, Paizo would definitely become the target of internet trolls worldwide. It's just the nature of the beast, you could say. ;)

People might poke the 400 pound version more. After all, it is not uncommon for the 800 pound types to simply ignore the pokes. Realistic or not, some will expect more response out of the lighter gorilla.

Whether so poking is wise, given a change in responsiveness, is another question. ;)
 

You cut to the quick, sir. 3e has sailed for WotC, something many of us agree with. It's not a slight on your edition of choice. I was simply prefacing my comment about WotC building on the current edition fan base, whom they still have.
With the matter of whether WotC can reclaim the players lost to Pathfinder being a separate question.

I am not certain that WotC can ever reclaim their position as 800 lb. gorillalala.

I do think that a BECMI approach might help, at least in regard to new players. Opening 4e/5e back up with the OGL might help.

But with 3.X, I think that WotC burned their boats, they cannot go back again.

The Auld Grump
 

Remove ads

Top