Death by Infelicitas - Is it acceptable?

[Jon_Dahl]

Recently I made a 15 question query for my players (I hope someone asks me to show the questions ) and one of them was this:

Can bad dice rolls kill characters? Can characters die at all?

So far the players have been purely against such practice. One says that characters can only die from a consistent bad luck and you must have the chance to escape from the situation before you "accumulate" enough bad rolls. One says that the death must always be meaningful or result from player's own stupidity. The latter opinion has garnered support from other players.

I must say that I'm gutted by their views but since this is a consensus I must accept it or leave.
Instant death depends on the game but if we think about fantasy for instance, I like that there are some powerful spells that can possibly kill you outright. In modern and sci-fi games we have weapons and grenades etc. I certainly want a bullet to the neck to kill my character and I want such shots to be possible. Live fast, die fast I say. And besides I like making new characters.

How do you feel about it? After a failed save vs. death do you rip your character sheet and tell your GM to stuff it or just create a new PC?

 

[S'mon]

It depends on the game - as a general rule yes, certainly, the possibility of death by die roll is usually vital for the kind of game I like. But there are games, especially more character-focused ones, where it can be best to moderate this, eg by the use of Fate Points. I once had a PC Zana Than die to random orc in a high-drama Midnight game, the GM brought in Fate Points next session but it kinda ruined the game. Conversely I've played a 4e game where the GM Would. Not. Let. Us. Die. - and when we realised it that pretty well ruined that game, too.

 

[Serendipity]

I note with some amusement that there isn't an option for simply accepting such a roll; perhaps a bit of preselection bias?
In any case, I also like a certain degree of lethality to my games. I don't dislike save or die, for example.

 

[Jon_Dahl]

I note with some amusement that there isn't an option for simply accepting such a roll; perhaps a bit of preselection bias?

Well I feel that the existing options adequately cover all the options. I'm sorry if you don't agree. Any bias is unintended.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I accept death by infelicity without reservation, and have been stung by it many times. Sometimes, your PC is just NOT the hero of the saga. Sometimes, your PC is Elpenor.

Most famously, I had a 2Ed Dwarf die from failing a series of rolls that- according to my mathematician buddies- equalled the odds of winning the Texas lottery.

But I've also had other brushes with the ass end of Fortune. I rolled a 2 for a 1/2Orc Ranger to avoid going over a cliff side. I had a Player's Option Cleric- dubbed "Superman" by another player who didn't like the way I built him compared to HIS cleric- get one shotted in his first combat.

I'm one of those rare people who had a PC die during character creation in Traveller.

I had a MechWarrior PC die in his first combat- his mech was head-shotted upon landing in the drop zone.

The first time I encountered the Deck of Many Things, my PC drew the Void card.

And in all of those situations, after a moment of "Rackafratz!"-ing, I either started to make a new PC, grabbed a backup PC I had already prepared, or ask the GM if I could help him run NPC for the rest of the evening.









HOLY CRAP! I just realized I'm a black guy with a bunch of red shirts in my wardrobe! I really AM just here to show the seriousness of the situation!

 

[Spinachcat]

D&D has easy access to resurrection. Most other RPGs do not, but constently the topic of players upset about PC death is a D&D focussed topic.

I find that odd.

 

[ComradeGnull]

I think it depends on the expectations of the game, and also the complexity of character creation. In games where players are expected to spend significant time developing the background and personality of their character, it seems a bit dumb to pair that idea with being one-shotted by slipping on the stairs as you leave the inn during your first adventure. For other games, it is entirely appropriate.

So my answer would be: depends on how much player investment is required during the period between character creation and when there is access to resurrection.

 

[Serendipity]

Well I feel that the existing options adequately cover all the options. I'm sorry if you don't agree. Any bias is unintended.

No, I wasn't making any kind of serious accusation of bias or whatever. (Sorry, humor seldom comes across well on the internet. I'll learn this one day.)
It just seems you didn't expect anyone to agree with you.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

You know, I incorporate a lot of 'narrativist' rules that tend to give PCs an edge when it comes to survival and generally in shaping the campaign to their wills-- consequently, I feel absolutely no compulsion whatsoever to fudge die rolls in their favor.

Of course, I'm also trying to train my group to understand that losing can be fun and doesn't have to be the end of the campaign. We'll see how it goes.

 

[Jhaelen]

After a failed save vs. death do you rip your character sheet and tell your GM to stuff it or just create a new PC?

I never rip up character sheets. If they are truly and finally dead they're transferred to a 'graveyard folder'.

Considering a save vs. death (that actually results in death if failed) should typically only come up when the party has a couple of levels under their belt, I wouldn't worry since it shouldn't be difficult to get access to someone with the ability to resurrect my character.

In other words: If there's plenty of death saving throws called for, there should be plenty of means to get resurrected again, too.

If you're asking about 'final death', though, I would stop playing if it happened too often. I tend to put a lot of work in my characters and I hate to see them go.

Luckily, in the past it's been almost always my own stupidity that got my characters killed and I don't mind that at all (well actually I do, but I consider it an important aspect of the game: stupid mistakes _should_ get you killed from time to time).

Now, if you're talking about one-off adventures, I don't mind character death, but then I also didn't invest much time when creating the character and I'm also not invested in a 'campaign'. Meeting regularly to play on-offs can be fun, too.