One of my players is attempting to hit on one of my NPCs!!!

[Sunseeker]

The NPC either likes him, or not.

If only love were so simple.

@OP: I think at this point it's important to consider making your NPC a little more in depth. She's a non-nonsense martial type who's got a good nature. There are some things that are going to appeal to that and some that aren't. A finely crafted blade or shield as a gift, as opposed to flowers and chocolate. Actions are likely going to speak louder than words so doing good things for the people the Captain is in charge of will help her see the character as having admirable qualities.

But you might want to fine-tune her feelings a little bit, does she like long, romantic walks on the beach or a lot of drinks and a flashy smile that she won't remember in the morning?

Being both an "ice-maiden" and "naive and good-hearted" seem fairly contradictory, not impossible, but people who are jaded and closed off to others are not the types who generally believe in the inherent goodness of humanity.

Really unless the NPC has pre-built reactions, motives, or feelings from a given book, really it's up to you. Based on how you've made this NPC, what would she respond best to? And of course, don't make it too easy for the player to figure out.

 

[steenan]

The NPC target is the captain of the guard in a small town; I've depicted her as a bit of a strictly-business ice maiden type (though shes naieve and good-hearted). The player has given some treasures she found as gifts, and engaged her as a martial trainer.

What now? I'm considering a few ideas, but would love feedback

That's how I would handle that:
- No rolls to advance the relationship, if it's honest. If the player puts some effort in pursuing this matter, it should be enough. If it's seduction, then definitely Bluff.
- Think why the NPC behaves the way she behaves. What she values, what are her goals and motivations. Then you'll be able to deduce how she'll react to various things the PC can do. You'll also have solid guidelines on how to roleplay her in conversations.
- Throw in some complications that the player will have to handle. Maybe she's not interested in a relationship because she has to focus on her duties? Help her solve the crime she's investigating and suddenly she has much more time for you. Or maybe there is another man interested in her, with safer and more prestigious lifestyle than adventuring?
- If the player becomes invested in the relationship, don't kill the NPC (or do something similar) without giving players a way to prevent it. On the other hand, if the player knows that she needs him and decides to ignore it, hit him hard with consequences.

Have you encountered this kind of thing in your game before? Did it produce a nice background element to your campaign, or just get kinda weird?? Please share your stories!!

Various romance plots are common in our games. I don't remember any longer game that wouldn't have any present. Sometimes, that are PC-PC relations, sometimes PC-NPC.

In the campaign in which I currently play, three of five characters are romantically involved with NPCs (the other two characters are an eunuch and a human-eating shapeshifting monster). To make things more interesting, these are very different types relations. One couple is preparing for a political marriage and they are not sure what they feel towards each other. Other couple is having an intense and stormy romance, but they don't really talk much about the future. The third relation is a friendship, that recently turned romantic.

In an earlier campaign I ran, one of the characters romanced with one of the enemies: a lady of plague, who wanted to destroy the world. They lied, they plotted, they stopped each other's plots and they sometimes fought directly - it didn't stop them from being lovers for the whole time.

In another game, my character's lover was a noble in a land that other PC's ally wanted to conquer. Of course, it created some beautiful complications, including direct confrontation between our PCs and tense negotiations with threat of world-shaking magic on both sides.

 

[Dwimmerlied]

Being both an "ice-maiden" and "naive and good-hearted" seem fairly contradictory...

I knew I'd be pulled up on this

In fact it kinda made sense in my head; in words, not so much. I will say, creating compelling NPCs is quite a lot of work. I've generally in the past let personalities just evolve naturally with play; though as with this case, its obviously nice if it can be prepared in advance.

I think I'm tending toward agreeing that skill/ability checks have little place in this; at best, a charisma check might serve to draw that initial "spark", "chemistry" or whatever, but the basis for relationship on whatever terms depends more on actions and personality.

 

[Dwimmerlied]

Everything

Awesome

Its interesting; form this, and a few other posts, it seems that there's an interesting contrast; One standard assumption is that the game rolls naturally and with simplicity; characters get together for some action and to roll some dice. Its simple, good and very enjoyable.

Other games seem to invest a great deal in immersion, and though I don't know how much work goes into these games, I can only imagine that it must be substantial. From some of the accounts from this thread and others, it looks rewarding; you can read these posts and think it would be quite engaging to be part of these games. I'm a perfectionist, and enjoy gaming enough to want to perhaps produce games that are this interesting. For those who game like this, how much time and energy do you find you invest? Does it ever lead to burnout?

 

[pemerton]

My current game doesn't have romance in it (though that may be about to change - one PC has made a date with a crazed drow wizard). But my previous campaign had a bit - one of the enduring drivers of the game was the romantic relationship between a PC samurai warrior/mage and a (shapeshifting) dragon. In the same game another PC was a bit of a late bloomer, wooing and eventually at the end of the campaign marrying a wizard who was rescued from demons on the ethereal plane. Likewise the game before that - at one stage one player was playing two PCs, both his main PC and her lover.

When we play we tend not to foreground the actual romancing too much - in the case of the samurai and the dragon, it's enough for the player to say that's he's taking her to the theatre, for instance, and deduct the requisite money from his character sheet - but that relationship and it significance was one of the major drivers for many years of play in the campaign.

Other games seem to invest a great deal in immersion, and though I don't know how much work goes into these games, I can only imagine that it must be substantial. From some of the accounts from this thread and others, it looks rewarding; you can read these posts and think it would be quite engaging to be part of these games. I'm a perfectionist, and enjoy gaming enough to want to perhaps produce games that are this interesting. For those who game like this, how much time and energy do you find you invest? Does it ever lead to burnout?

I'm not [MENTION=23240]steenan[/MENTION], and I don't know if my game would fit the description you put forward.

With my group, "immersion" in the sense of "being there" isn't that important. A lot of PC dialogue is in third person, for instance. But I try to run a game in which the players take the story and its themes seriously, and will push hard with their PCs much the same as I am trying to push them hard.

In the case of the samurai/dragon romance, for instance, once the player sets off with his PC on a path of "forbidden love" (how can any mortal be a suitable partner for a dragon!?) then I will bring that into play and expect the player to engage with it. So I guess we have "immersion" in the story, and the emotions/tension that it generates.

Does this requires time? A bit from me as GM, no more than the play time and a bit of email communiation among the players.

Does this require energy? At least a bit of energy at the gaming table, to follow along and take things seriously.

Does this lead to burnout? I've been GMing weekly or fornightly for the past 23+ years. My group's membership has changed a bit over the years, but of the current lineup two players have been in it for over 15 years. So it doesn't seem to!

 

[Empirate]

I just can't believe how many people think "skill check or Cha roll" first, instead of "awesome, this is gonna be great roleplaying". Seriously. Romance is such an important part of life, and arguably an even more important part of all kinds of storytelling (novels, plays, many many TV formats, opera, movies, fairytales...), that just rolling for it, or hiding it away "off stage", or even just cutting to the chase instead of playing out the dialogue, mood, gestures, is an utterly strange idea to me.

Your player, OP, might expect or want you to apply game mechanics instead of pure roleplaying; "awkward" and all that. But if you can handle this seriously and maturely, play it out, and enjoy a new facet to your game that will give it sooo much more depth!

 

[steenan]

For those who game like this, how much time and energy do you find you invest? Does it ever lead to burnout?

While I suffered a burnout once and had to stop GMing for about half a year, it was definitely not because of the style of play you describe.

Really, it is easier for me to run a game where players engage in relationships with NPCs and care about what happens to them. Players push forward and direct the plot, taking a lot of work off my shoulders. I probably spend a little more time making sure that various NPCs are interesting, but I definitely save a lot of effort compared to creating the whole plot by myself and then motivating the players to follow it.

Also, the input from engaged players is really inspiring. Instead of basing everything on my own creativity, I take players' ideas - their PCs' goals, beliefs and actions - and build on that. It makes this play style more natural for me than "some action and some dice".

 

[Starfox]

Being both an "ice-maiden" and "naive and good-hearted" seem fairly contradictory, not impossible, but people who are jaded and closed off to others are not the types who generally believe in the inherent goodness of humanity.

Seems to me to be the "It is easier to love all of humanity than to love a single person" kind of personality. Common in nuns and paladins, goes well with chastity. As a tough lady, she might also have some bad romantic encounters in her backstory, with guys who like their women more "traditional". Makes her not want to get hurt again, so she put on the "Ice Lady" facade (probably subconsciously) but really is more of a warm and good-hearted person.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I just can't believe how many people think "skill check or Cha roll" first, instead of "awesome, this is gonna be great roleplaying". Seriously. Romance is such an important part of life, and arguably an even more important part of all kinds of storytelling (novels, plays, many many TV formats, opera, movies, fairytales...), that just rolling for it, or hiding it away "off stage", or even just cutting to the chase instead of playing out the dialogue, mood, gestures, is an utterly strange idea to me.

I'm not one of the people who proposed a die roll, but ... I'm actually incredibly tired at how much romance turns up in books I otherwise like. Reading the same thing for the thousandth time (probably literally, I read a vast number of books, at least one per three days if I'm too bored to actually read something) is boring. A Song of Ice and Fire is one of the few books that did it right, in that every romance seems to be plot-relevant in some way (even the nastier or abusive cases, which is realistic but not at all fun to read about).

Writing about romance (or RP'ing it from the DM side) is hard, and if the DM would rather just roll dice and move on, good for them.

 

[N'raac]

The answer always seems, to me, to be "it depends". It seems like no one is opposed to the romance, so you could just play it out.

As an "ice maiden", perhaps there is a need for a roll to break through and make it clear he is sincere. If you want to play out that aspect, there's no reason it could not be done through Diplomacy (if he is sincere) or Bluff (if he is not). Her Sense Motive could reasonably detect either that he is not sincere (oposed vs Bluff) or that he is sincere (augmented rather than opposed by Diplomacy). Of course, she could certainly believe he is sincere but have no romantic interest - maybe he has to persevere (try again after 24 hours).

My first step would be to assess the character's backstory and personality to assess whether she is likely to be attracted, or not to be. If nothing there suggests an answer, then what's good for the story? It sounds like you want to encourage, not discourage, this role playing, so rewarding it with success seems the preferable approach, even if you require a few die rolls along the way.