Legends & Lore: Roleplaying in D&D Next

[MarkB]

It sounds as though you actually have played FATE though... which means that indeed, it's middle-of-the-ground to you. But this'll be a huge sea change for large groups of players. So a small toe-dip to you is going to be a full-on dousing for most other people, and thus an all-or-nothing approach is pointless. If they wanted to play FATE, they'd play FATE. The fact they are still playing D&D says something... and thus just putting in a taste of FATE is all you really need. And for those who think it's not FATE enough... they can just go back and play FATE itself.

True enough - I do play and enjoy Fate, so that does colour my view.

I'm just not sure a half-baked version of the fate point system is such a good idea in practice. It risks putting off those who don't like the concept without satisfying those who do.

 

[Alzrius]

Once again... this comes down to the question of "What is 'core'?"

Indeed it does.

What is Core? (with apologies to Haddaway)

[video=youtube;xhrBDcQq2DM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhrBDcQq2DM[/video]

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
What is Core?
Yeah

Oh I don’t know, what class to use
So many powers, simply abused
So what’s allowed? What’s disavowed?
Gimme a book

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore

Roll roll roooooll, roooooll, roooooll
Roll roll roooooll, roooooll, roooooll

Oh I don’t know, what race to be
Any I want or, just PHB
I’ll pick just one, to try and see
I just can’t decide

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore

Roll roll roooooll, roooooll, roooooll
Roll roll roooooll, roooooll, roooooll

What is Core?
What is Core?

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore

Adds new rules
Adds new rules

I play no other, no other campaign
This is your game, play time
So when we are playing, be adjudicating
Is it Core?

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore

What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore
What is Core?
DM adds new rules
Adds new rules galore

What is Core?

 

[ExploderWizard]

There are lots of successful games that provide mechanical benefits for roleplaying your character. Point-buy games like GURPS gave extra character points for taking role-playing related disads. More modern games like Savage Worlds provide benes when you fulfill one of your character attributes. It hasn't been a part of standard-issue D&D, but it's hardly an aberration.

-KS

Other games do a lot of things. I love GURPS for what it is,which is quite different from D&D. People play different kinds of games to experience a variety of things. At least they are reprinting AD&D and OD&D, so there will still be some representation of what the game is actually about still in print.

 

[GX.Sigma]

I didn't get the impression that it had anything to do with funny voices. It seems mostly left up to the DM, so I suppose that individuals could chose to use it like that, but I think you could just as easily interpret what he wrote to reward PCs for doing things they normal wouldn't, like you suggest.

The article says this:

The key lies in describing your action in an interesting way, acting out your character's dialogue, or otherwise helping to bring the game to life

To me, that says "doing something you normally do, but with a lame accent." That doesn't sound like something worthy of a weird, socially tricky reward. I, as a DM, don't understand how I'm supposed to use this system. Why would I give players rewards for doing what they normally do?

Talking in a funny voice and creatively narrating your character's actions is not what roleplaying is about. It's about making choices. This kind of system only makes sense to me when you reward players for making a choice they wouldn't normally make (as in the Fate system). That system also discourages powergaming, since the only way to benefit is to make sub-optimal choices. This system encourages powergaming, because you're still power-attacking the orc with your +2 greataxe, but you're also giving a 200-page description to fish for 'inspiration' from the DM. I'll pass.

Having said that, I'm sure this "core rule" will be little more than a sentence in the DMG: "Consider giving your players a bonus on their roll if they narrate their action creatively." Thus, it seems pretty benign.

 

[The Shadow]

I think Dausuul has hit the nail on the head. By "baked in", I think Mearls means we'll see class features that reference this mechanic.

The paladin code might be a source of Inspiration. Bard song might enable Inspirations to be shared with the whole group. Clerics might spend Inspiration to recover a use of Channel Divinity. And so on.

If the mechanic is truly baked into the core, then I expect the bit we saw to be only the tip of the iceberg.

And ExploderWizard, there certainly are poker games that give extra cards for betting. Ever play Seven Card Draw? Likewise, there's plenty of games that mechanically reward roleplaying, of which Fate is a conspicuous example. I for one enjoy it highly, so please don't tell me it isn't "really" roleplaying.

 

[KidSnide]

Giving mechanical benefits for roleplaying in a roleplaying game is like giving someone who actually bet, extra cards in poker. I guess there just weren't quite enough ways to powergame with character build fiddly bits alone, so this is what we get.

There are lots of successful games that provide mechanical benefits for roleplaying your character. Point-buy games like GURPS gave extra character points for taking role-playing related disads. More modern games like Savage Worlds provide benes when you fulfill one of your character attributes. It hasn't been a part of standard-issue D&D, but it's hardly an aberration.

Other games do a lot of things. I love GURPS for what it is,which is quite different from D&D. People play different kinds of games to experience a variety of things. At least they are reprinting AD&D and OD&D, so there will still be some representation of what the game is actually about still in print.

Quotes included for context...

Yeah, sure, it's totally OK to say that rewarding role-playing should be part of D&D for whatever reason you care to provide (including history and personal preference). But your original quote suggested that role-playing rewards didn't belong in role-playing games, and there are many successful counter-examples to that proposition.

-KS

 

[ExploderWizard]

And ExploderWizard, there certainly are poker games that give extra cards for betting. Ever play Seven Card Draw? Likewise, there's plenty of games that mechanically reward roleplaying, of which Fate is a conspicuous example. I for one enjoy it highly, so please don't tell me it isn't "really" roleplaying.

The day D&D becomes FATE is the day D&D dies.

 

[DEFCON 1]

The day D&D becomes FATE is the day D&D dies.

Certain people have said D&D is dead after every single edition of the rules. If this rule addition is what finally kills it for you, consider yourself one of the lucky ones that had 40 years of D&D still alive regardless of the rules changes that were introduced over that time.

 

[DEFCON 1]

The article says this:To me, that says "doing something you normally do, but with a lame accent." That doesn't sound like something worthy of a weird, socially tricky reward. I, as a DM, don't understand how I'm supposed to use this system. Why would I give players rewards for doing what they normally do?

Maybe you don't need to. Maybe it's for all the other game tables where the players aren't doing that normally.

Why do RPGs still put in their rules that the DM should encourage players to write character histories because it'll help flesh out their character? Simple. Cause many players still don't do it.

If your game doesn't need Inspiration because your players already create glorious flaws for your PCs that impact your game and how they react and relate to everybody else, creating wonderful conflict and intriguing storylines... consider yourself lucky.

Not everyone has that. Or knows how to accomplish it.

 

[Savage Wombat]

I'd say a mixture of "baked in" and optional. I've played enough systems with "hero points" and the like that an official rule for what such a bennie is, and how you would use it to affect play, is for the best. Then you can make optional rules for how the players earn them, ranging from "none" to "three per session".

I'm also reminded of a golden gaming rule - "if you reward the players for doing something, they'll do more of it." Thus - DMs should have the freedom to decide how inspiration points are earned in their games.