Pathfinder 1E So what do you think is wrong with Pathfinder? Post your problems and we will fix it.

[ForeverSlayer]

Bolded the important part. Your flesh isn't stitching itself back together or anything, you're just fighting through it(probably with an adrenaline rush) until you can tend to them later.

As far as the whole hiding in plain sight thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahg6qcgoay4

You do know that you can be dropped to 1 hp and regenerate back to full health and stay there. If this was temporary then I could see it but you do heal.

 

[Wicht]

Bolded the important part. Your flesh isn't stitching itself back together or anything, you're just fighting through it(probably with an adrenaline rush) until you can tend to them later.

You know, as I said before, I don't really have a dog in this fight. I don't really care about 4e warriors one way or the other and I fully understand that 4e is ambiguous about things so that you can reskin it however you want. But if you have to make the argument that a power that gives you regeneration 2+ Con is not really giving you regeneration, then I think you are at the point where you are just being contrary to be contrary. Regeneration is more or less defined as your flesh stitching itself back together.

That being said, regeneration can be explained in non-magical terms, but its still pretty extraordinary and super-human.

 

[Abraxas]

But seriously, do you imagine the player using this power just says. "I just stand there and I'm invisible, not even trying to hide."? If so, then I imagine your confusion. Personally if this power was used I'd either ask the player why he is invisible or just make up why the enemies dont see him.

Perhaps he is posing next to a statue? Or dropped to the ground just in time? It's all dependant on the situation.

Would you disallow the use of the the Hide in Plain Sight/Hide from the Light powers if there character was out in the open with nothing to hide behind/in? (there are ways to get the initial conditions need to start hiding that wouldn't persist beyond the time needed to set up these powers)

My Brutal Scoundrel Rogue/Dagger Master/Prison of the Winds used these powers to great effect and once he got a reliable means of flight would use them while in mid air all the time. He was an invisible flying death machine with his graceful dagger and 30 DEX

I'll note that the "Martials are magic" crowd has yet to name a single magical ability that martial characters can do.

Marking powers that don't require the character to actually be able to attack the target
Unyielding Avalanche
Warrior's Urging

Many of the rogue powers that use charisma as a modifier to effects
Hide from the light
Impossible to Catch

Wings of Deviltry

Is every Martial Power "Magical"? No.
Are some Martial Powers "Magic"? Yes.

Also, I'm with HardcoreDandDGirl in that 2E is my favorite version (although I'll play every version and Pathfinder)

 

[Ahnehnois]

If I'm playing a fighter who has dedicated his entire life to learning the best ways to kill people and other things than during combat the decisions I make as a player should have more impact than the players of characters who are not as focused. It should not be a more satisfying play experience to play a wizard or cleric during combat than a fighter when they have more resources to make meaningful decisions to make outside of combat. Numbers be damned.

Of course not. But if anything, I would turn that around and say that playing a wizard should convey a sense of magic and mystery, when largely what it conveys is a sense of endless bookkeeping and futility. I've yet to have my first player come to me saying that playing a fighter isn't enjoyable or rewarding in all the areas that it should be. If it isn't for you, I'm not clear as to why.

 

[herrozerro]

Would you disallow the use of the the Hide in Plain Sight/Hide from the Light powers if there character was out in the open with nothing to hide behind/in? (there are ways to get the initial conditions need to start hiding that wouldn't persist beyond the time needed to set up these powers)

If the player couldn't come up with a valid response or I couldn't think of a good reason for the enemies not to see him or her then yes.

but we are talking about hiding in a featureless plane. I'm willing to work with trying to blend in with the background, hiding up a wall or hanging from a ceiling. I'm willing to take extraordinary explanations.

 

[Imaro]

If the player couldn't come up with a valid response or I couldn't think of a good reason for the enemies not to see him or her then yes.

but we are talking about hiding in a featureless plane. I'm willing to work with trying to blend in with the background, hiding up a wall or hanging from a ceiling. I'm willing to take extraordinary explanations.

Ok, but earlier you said it was up to the player to decide whether him using the martial power source was a form of magic or not, so if the player does describe it that way do you still have a problem with him/her hiding on a featureless plain?

 

[herrozerro]

Ok, but earlier you said it was up to the player to decide whether him using the martial power source was a form of magic or not, so if the player does describe it that way do you still have a problem with him/her hiding on a featureless plain?

In what way? If he has some kind of magic? Sure. My above statement is for a character that has described himself or herself as mundane.

 

[Imaro]

In what way? If he has some kind of magic? Sure. My above statement is for a character that has described himself or herself as mundane.

He is making his martial power source magical...

So why penalize one martial character because of his description and not the other one... Why does describing martial power as magical allow that fighter to hide on a featureless plain but not the one who describes his as being... just that sneaky?

 

[herrozerro]

He is making his martial power source magical...

So why penalize one martial character because of his description and not the other one... Why does describing martial power as magical allow that fighter to hide on a featureless plain but not the one who describes his as being... just that sneaky?

Because some situations are just impossible without magic. That's just how it rolls. If that player wants to tap into some martial magic, it's up to the player. If the player wants to keep his character purely mundane there will be no complaints.

Edit: If you want to ask me a question, just ask it. This going back and forth trying to trap me in some kind of logic error is tiring. Besides I thought you done with this conversation because you came to the realization that neither of us were going to change each other's mind.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

But if you have to make the argument that a power that gives you regeneration 2+ Con is not really giving you regeneration, then I think you are at the point where you are just being contrary to be contrary. Regeneration is more or less defined as your flesh stitching itself back together.

Pretty much this.