D&D 5E (2014) Dealing with a trouble player and a major blow up
- Thread starter Majoru Oakheart
- Start date
Mercule
Adventurer
The only reason I'm allowing for the benefit of doubt is because there appears to exist at least one DM who doesn't have issues with the guy. For all we know, that DM has issues of his own. IME, that's the sort of thing that should make someone stop and look for alternate causality that the other guy being a jerk. That may still be the final answer, but the question is worth asking.
From the OP's raw description, though, I'd agree with you.
vandaexpress
First Post
I'll echo what everyone else has said. Approach the player privately outside the game and express your concerns, if he doesn't want to play ball, then cut him loose. If he takes all of his buddies with him, it's time for you to find a new gaming group. It's not worth the drama.
I strongly recommend developing your ability to network and recruit new players as sound advice for any DM. Ideally, you want to be in a position where you have so many people wanting to play in your games that you have a wait list. It makes it much easier to eject disruptive players from the campaign. Additionally, if you set the expectation early on that not every one of your friends is in your D&D group, it removes a lot of the social pressures tied to it.
Following this advice, coupled with developing your DM skills, is what enables you to cherry pick the best players and run the best campaigns. Chris Perkins follows the same idea, he's extremely picky of who he DMs for in his regular campaigns. I am as well. If I see someone who has an argumentative personality or doesn't play well with others, they aren't in my group. You can save yourself a LOT of headache if you learn to recognize problem players before you ever invite them to play in your game.
YMMV.
I strongly recommend developing your ability to network and recruit new players as sound advice for any DM. Ideally, you want to be in a position where you have so many people wanting to play in your games that you have a wait list. It makes it much easier to eject disruptive players from the campaign. Additionally, if you set the expectation early on that not every one of your friends is in your D&D group, it removes a lot of the social pressures tied to it.
Following this advice, coupled with developing your DM skills, is what enables you to cherry pick the best players and run the best campaigns. Chris Perkins follows the same idea, he's extremely picky of who he DMs for in his regular campaigns. I am as well. If I see someone who has an argumentative personality or doesn't play well with others, they aren't in my group. You can save yourself a LOT of headache if you learn to recognize problem players before you ever invite them to play in your game.
YMMV.
Sacrosanct
Legend
We only have one side of the story of course, but taking it at face value, my biggest issue isn't with the in game behavior. Anyone who just ditches their friends like that, especially a girl/boyfriend, would be more than enough for me to not associate with them in any capacity going forward. That's pretty horrible behavior.
ExploderWizard
Hero
Yeah that was the part that made me question how this guy has a girlfriend. Getting upset enough over a game to strand your girlfriend rises to the level of intolerable behavior, period.
Even though this is a D&D forum, I would suggest your issues are bigger than the game.
You state that you are friends, and have many mutual friends. That seems to be the major concern. You are not just talking about how this affects your game, but how it affects your whole social circle.
You really need to sit down with your friend and talk things out. It may turn out that playing D&D together is not worth it. Maybe you can reach a happy compromise in your play styles.
Either way, I would at least try to have a resonable discussion. You may want to read up on conflict resolution. One quick suggestion, avoid using the word 'You' during the discussion. Always speak from the 'I' perspective. i.e. Rather than "You are always arguing with me when we game" say "I think that our verbal conflict make the game less fun for everyone".
You state that you are friends, and have many mutual friends. That seems to be the major concern. You are not just talking about how this affects your game, but how it affects your whole social circle.
You really need to sit down with your friend and talk things out. It may turn out that playing D&D together is not worth it. Maybe you can reach a happy compromise in your play styles.
Either way, I would at least try to have a resonable discussion. You may want to read up on conflict resolution. One quick suggestion, avoid using the word 'You' during the discussion. Always speak from the 'I' perspective. i.e. Rather than "You are always arguing with me when we game" say "I think that our verbal conflict make the game less fun for everyone".
I've had similar problems in the past, though nowhere near as bad so at least in some capacity I can understand you. I DMed a game where 1 player rarely, if ever joined in the roleplaying, which isn't necessarily a bad thing - all players are different and I acknowledge some like to just be there and enjoy the atmosphere. The problem came when I would put a challenge up to the group in general, like a tough fight, a hard situation or a nasty trap. Every single time they'd argue for about 10 minutes about why what I was doing was unfair, or give constant comments along the game about how something was stupid or nonsensical. There was a real problem because the rest of the group didn't want to play without them there for some reason.
Eventually I realised running the game was causing me far more stress than it was worth, so I just ended the campaign abruptly one night, and over the next few months found myself a new group to join. Don't regret that decision one bit.
Eventually I realised running the game was causing me far more stress than it was worth, so I just ended the campaign abruptly one night, and over the next few months found myself a new group to join. Don't regret that decision one bit.
It's much harder to find a new DM than it is to find more players. Ditch the guy, if his friends drop your game out of spite or loyalty then just get more players. Talk about it with a few players who would probably keep playing with you regardless, and ask them if they would start a new campaign with you or just reboot this one. So end the game, be selective about your players, and invite only those you enjoy gaming with and being around.
D&D players come and go, and annoying jerks you are better off without. You have to be willing to walk out of this kind of immature or even abusive relationship. If the only reason you're gaming with this person is because of fear of losing other friends and not gaming, that is not a good reason. I agree with others who say no gaming is better than bad gaming. After a blow up from a player who didn't like our DM's style last summer ended up derailing the campaign, within two months I had another group going with all brand new players I found online, and I found the gaming was actually more fun than with older friends. Sometimes you need to mix things up. You'll be surprised, the oldest relationships are not always the best or strongest or most fulfilling or even true friendships. Momentum is not a good reason to spend time with people who argue with you or make your life hell. If you're willing to walk and you're not bluffing, you regain the power in these situations. Sometimes it's better to be alone than compromise who you are or what you need out of a relationship, and that goes for all kinds, spouses, girlfriends, friends, D&D groupies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JFEfdK_Ls
D&D players come and go, and annoying jerks you are better off without. You have to be willing to walk out of this kind of immature or even abusive relationship. If the only reason you're gaming with this person is because of fear of losing other friends and not gaming, that is not a good reason. I agree with others who say no gaming is better than bad gaming. After a blow up from a player who didn't like our DM's style last summer ended up derailing the campaign, within two months I had another group going with all brand new players I found online, and I found the gaming was actually more fun than with older friends. Sometimes you need to mix things up. You'll be surprised, the oldest relationships are not always the best or strongest or most fulfilling or even true friendships. Momentum is not a good reason to spend time with people who argue with you or make your life hell. If you're willing to walk and you're not bluffing, you regain the power in these situations. Sometimes it's better to be alone than compromise who you are or what you need out of a relationship, and that goes for all kinds, spouses, girlfriends, friends, D&D groupies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JFEfdK_Ls
Majoru Oakheart
Adventurer
Some more background for people who care. I've known his girlfriend for about 15 years now. I've known him for about 8. I met him when I started running public games of 4e LFR at the store that his girlfriend worked at. She broke up with her ex bf and didn't have a place to go so she moved in with me. Back then he wasn't really my friend. I used to complain to almost anyone who would listen that I had to deal with his stupidity at my table when he would show up. He offered to run a game and read the entire thing in monotone extremely slowly and he didn't know what the word constable meant. So we never let him run again. I wondered if he could read. I put up with him because it was only once a week and the game was public.
Then after about 4 months of him showing up for games his girlfriend told me she was going on a date with him and I asked her why. She knew how much of an idiot he was. She said she knew that and agreed with me but he was good looking and she had just broken up with her boyfriend and wanted something not too serious. Then, somewhere around their 3rd date she never came home. 3 months later she still hadn't come home but paid me rent at DnD. Finally, she told me she had decided to move in with him and set foot in my house long enough to grab the essentials and let me keep everything else.
My opinion of him hasn't changed in the 8 years. He is dumb. He is constantly suggesting REALLY dumb ideas to problems in our games. The ideas are bad enough that even his girlfriend is constantly saying, "I love you. But that's dumb." Other people ignore his ideas mostly, but I tend to get frustrated over people being stupid and I admit, I let him get to me and sometimes over the course of a session I just get more and more angry that I have to put up with this. But I do, because I've been friends with his girlfriend for 15 years and she is one of the best role players I know.
Then after about 4 months of him showing up for games his girlfriend told me she was going on a date with him and I asked her why. She knew how much of an idiot he was. She said she knew that and agreed with me but he was good looking and she had just broken up with her boyfriend and wanted something not too serious. Then, somewhere around their 3rd date she never came home. 3 months later she still hadn't come home but paid me rent at DnD. Finally, she told me she had decided to move in with him and set foot in my house long enough to grab the essentials and let me keep everything else.
My opinion of him hasn't changed in the 8 years. He is dumb. He is constantly suggesting REALLY dumb ideas to problems in our games. The ideas are bad enough that even his girlfriend is constantly saying, "I love you. But that's dumb." Other people ignore his ideas mostly, but I tend to get frustrated over people being stupid and I admit, I let him get to me and sometimes over the course of a session I just get more and more angry that I have to put up with this. But I do, because I've been friends with his girlfriend for 15 years and she is one of the best role players I know.
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