D&D 5E Hypnotic Pattern

[SpiderMonkey]

Hi, all.

Lately my players have been using Hypnotic Pattern quite a bit (well, the bard and the wizard have, anyway). The tactic has been to catch as many foes as possible with it and then take whomever hasn't been affected. Then they merely tie up who's left.

Is this legal by the rules? At a cursory glance, it appears to be: it requires an attack or an action to get someone out of it.

I guess it worries me because it's starting to become an "I win" spell of sorts, and I want to adjudicate it to where it's still effective but not a nuke.

Cheers!

SM

 

[steeldragons]

Sounds like a very good tactic. And the party should have successes with it...but they can not use the "I win" button all of the time and, as the DM, that's kind of your job to see to.

The easiest/most obvious will be going up against enemy spellcasters who can Counterspell the effect right off, so it doesn't take effect. Following that, Dispel Magic all around. Works for enemy mages or clerics of sufficient level, druids you may have peeved off, bards...heck just about anybody can dispel magic.

Can't hypnotize what you can't see/can't see your pattern...Darkness sphere throughout the area to break p line of sight out to put a little crimp in that style. A pack of Drow or Tieflings with the ability (or ANY 3rd level or better arcane caster) can throw some Darkness sphere either on or around the party. Even, if there are already a bunch of hypnotized folks, throw darkness over them...next action, they'll be un-hypnotized and you can lower the darkness when the concentrating caster ends their Pattern spell. Fog cloud? Wall of Stone...any opaque spell that is going to block the pattern from being seen. Heck! A Minor -friggin- Image or any Illusion spell. *Poof* there's a wall/door/waterfall in front of you. Conjuration specialist's creation ability *Poof* blindfolds/bandanas over your eyes.

Yes, you will suffer for a round, maybe, or a penalty to try to fight while blind/keeping your eyes closed or covered. But you're not going to be out of the fight entirely.

Blind enemies! Spell's not gonna work on them. The only ones that come to mind, immediately, are Grimlocks. But if you're in a subterranean area for an adventure, some blind giant lizards or snakes (like real life, that have evolved to be blind since they are in complete darkness all of the time) that hunt off of smell. Bats! Obviously. Bats aren't going to be effects by a hypno pattern.

So, it is a very very effective spell. It is. But there are ways around it. Just need to give the foes they are facing a bit of magic of their own...or eliminate the problem area (their sight/seeing the hypno pattern).

Can't do it every fight, of course. But a couple sprinkled here or there...and certainly for "big fights" that are supposed to be climactic/challenging moments. May be enough to break the party thinking of "do this all of the time."

 

[MonkeezOnFire]

Yes, it is a legal tactic to use the spell to separate an encounter into two mini-encounters making them quite easier and often trivializing the encounter. There are many spells that do this. Sleep is another common one. Wall spells at higher level are often used to cut off ranged support.

But hypnotic pattern has weaknesses. It relies on the charmed condition which is a fairly common immunity in the monster manual. Have your group occasionally encounter groups of undead or constructs where the spell won't have any effect.

 

[steeldragons]

It relies on the charmed condition which is a fairly common immunity in the monster manual. Have your group occasionally encounter groups of undead or constructs where the spell won't have any effect.

Excellent point and another good work around. Can't charm what can't be (or at least stands a good chance not to be) charmed.

 

[bganon]

Yes, undead/constructs are almost always completely immune to charm, and elves (including drow) get advantage on saving throws vs charm. And while not specific to charm, quite a few fey creatures have magic resistance, which helps against any spell. Gnomes have some limited magic resistance too.

Even for things that are affected by the spell, standard mob tactics can help - surround the party when possible, don't cluster too tightly, stay close to opponents. Hypnotic Pattern is not all that party-friendly; anything inside the cube has to make the save and is incapacitated upon failure. Accidentally hitting the fighter with it would be terrible.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Hi, all.

Lately my players have been using Hypnotic Pattern quite a bit (well, the bard and the wizard have, anyway). The tactic has been to catch as many foes as possible with it and then take whomever hasn't been affected. Then they merely tie up who's left.

Is this legal by the rules? At a cursory glance, it appears to be: it requires an attack or an action to get someone out of it.

I guess it worries me because it's starting to become an "I win" spell of sorts, and I want to adjudicate it to where it's still effective but not a nuke.

Cheers!

SM

It's one of my gnome wild sorcerer's go-to spells.

I don't think it's any more of an "I win" spell than a well-placed fireball, really. Which is to say, in the right circumstances - a narrow corridor, a marching bunch of enemies, a tight bunch of critters around the party tank - it'll be pretty effective. But there's two big limitations on it.

First, the "right circumstances" aren't typically common - it might happen in a fight or two, but not every fight is against a tight cluster of enemies all on one side. It's not "friendly," so once a melee starts it's hard to catch enemies without catching allies. If even one enemy is not caught in it, that enemy can use its actions to end the spell's effectiveness pretty quickly by waking up its allies.

Second, the mechanics of the spell. As a Concentration spell, it prohibits other powerful buffs or debuffs from happening, and can be ended with a well-placed blow. As a spell that requires Wis saves and charm to work, it's ineffective against a pretty wide swath of enemies (particularly undead and anything with Legendary Resistance or advantage on Wis saves).

If you are seeing it be crazy effective, consider spacing your enemy groups farther apart (using a mix of ranged and melee monsters is pretty good for this), and don't rely on single-monster encounters. Also, make sure you're hitting the 6-8 encounters/day the DMG recommends - you run out of hypnotic patterns pretty quick at most levels when they win many encounters, and then you've gotta do something else.

 

[jgsugden]

Having a technique that is repeatedly useful is not a problem. For example, a fighter hits things with weapons every combat - is that a problem? It feels a bit wrong as a DM to have your encounters constantly beaten down by the same tactic, but it isn't a problem if the heroes feel heroic doing it and having success.

It is going to be a bit repetitive when parties use the same tactics, so you need to break it up a bit with immune enemies, enemies prepared for the tactics because they've heard of the PCs, PCs with countermeasures, etc... but when a party has a good tactic, it should be something they get a lot of use out of on a regular basis. Think of it this way: In the world of comic books, the heroes use the same abilities over and over and over... does that make them any less heroic?

 

[JackOfAllTirades]

I've also used Hypnotic Pattern to good effect, but it's not exactly an all-purpose spell. I'm playing a Warlock (Two Wizards in the party and I'm the only one with this spell!) so I have to use it sparingly and save it for targets with low Wisdom saves. I mostly use it on Beasts and Vermin, but in those cases it saves us a lot of trouble.

 

[keterys]

It's a strong spell, but I actually find it's not useful enough to be one of my staples.
1) Its area is pretty small; enemies are usually not grouped up enough to catch enough of the encounter in it. (one of last session's combats the enemies were spread across an 80 x 80 area so to get more than 2 I'd have needed to include a party member)
2) It has a save negates, which is often problematic with our DM (especially when we fight various draconic enemies, who are particularly good at saves IME)
3) Lots of stuff is immune (last session we fought plant creatures)
4) It's easy for those not affected to then wake up those who were affected, making it an effective 1 round stun instead of anything stronger

 

[Celtavian]

Hypnotic Pattern has been occasionally useful in our campaigns, but not problematic. I believe the entire intent of the spell is crowd control. If they are using it to freeze some enemies while killing those that avoid the effect, it is working as intended.