D&D 5E (2014) Enhancing "Hoard of the Dragon Queen" (Practical stuff to try at your table!)

[Dkase]

Where did the original party meet there end?

 

[pukunui]

Where did the original party meet there end?

I was running Scourge of the Sword Coast for that group. They met their end in the duergar-overtaken dwarf hold. My new campaign for that group is an episodic homebrew one.

My point was just that I spent the past month on that instead of on coming up with more ideas for my Tyranny of Dragons campaign. I think what I'm going to do is run some of the mini-adventures from DDEX1-1 Defiance in Phlan, just reworked to be in Elturel and Baldur's Gate.

 

[Dkase]

Baldur's Gate would probably be the better choice then Elturel since there is so much recent information published about it. Elturel, from what I remember in 4E, was pretty much an uber-paladin stronghold. There were some hints of big brother style oppression, but for the most part it was pretty undefined.

Having a fallen noble in the party could be a pretty good hook to get them back into the Tyranny of Dragons story line. Maybe her family has been indited in aiding and abetting the dragon cult? She gets back home to see the place surrounded by the Flaming Fist and has to prove her family's innocence, or maybe find out for herself how far the rabbit hole goes?

 

[pukunui]

Baldur's Gate would probably be the better choice then Elturel since there is so much recent information published about it. Elturel, from what I remember in 4E, was pretty much an uber-paladin stronghold. There were some hints of big brother style oppression, but for the most part it was pretty undefined.

Yeah, I've read the 4e FRCG entry. I'm inclined to ignore the oppressive aspects, especially since HotDQ makes no mention of it, and it doesn't seem like it would be a place where a fun-loving paladin who likes drinking (eg. Ontharr Frume) would be particularly welcome.

What I'm thinking I might do, though, is run the 4th mission from DDEX1-1 in Elturel. That's the one with the blue dragon tooth that has a weird lightning spell effect thing that leaps from person to person. I was planning on introducing an Emerald Enclave rep in Elturel to go along with Leosin and Ontharr, and that mission seems like a decent way to do it. I can either use the half-orc in the adventure or replace him with Delaan Winterhound (the EE rep from RoT).

Then I'm thinking I might run the first mission (the one with the exchange for a fake dragon egg) in the Outer City of Baldur's Gate. Maybe even in Blackgate. That one involves a Harper agent, who I could say was directed to the PCs by a message from Leosin. The third mission - the one in the polymorphed dragon's crypt - can be set in the cemetery in Tumbledown. I can keep the priest of Kelemvor and everything, and he can still introduce himself as a member of the Lords' Alliance.

I'm liking the idea of introducing all the possible factions early on, instead of just the Harpers and the Order of the Gauntlet. I can see the dwarf wizard PC wanting to join the Harpers, and possibly also the elf arcane trickster, while the goliath druid will find the Emerald Enclave most attractive. The human noble fighter I could see going either with the Order of the Gauntlet or the Lords' Alliance. Not too sure. Can't see anyone wanting to join the Zhentarim, which is fine with me.

Anyway, I'm also pondering the possibility of running the fifth mission from DDEX1-1 as well. Maybe instead of rogue Black Fists, the guys running the secret prison could be rogue Flaming Fists, and if the PCs end up reporting the prison's existence to the Fists, Ulder Ravengard will taken an interest in them, which will let me introduce him earlier than the council meetings in RoT. And he may invite PCs to join the Lords' Alliance as a result.

Having a fallen noble in the party could be a pretty good hook to get them back into the Tyranny of Dragons story line. Maybe her family has been indited in aiding and abetting the dragon cult? She gets back home to see the place surrounded by the Flaming Fist and has to prove her family's innocence, or maybe find out for herself how far the rabbit hole goes?

That's a possibility too. I'm not sure how personal I want to make it. It's possible I'll just let her use her status as a patriar to open otherwise closed doors (as per the noble background feature) and such. It'll certainly allow the PCs to wander around the Upper City at night, for one thing.

I'm wondering if it would be worth trying to work in some kind of meeting between the PCs and the dukes, where the PCs have to try to convince them not to interfere with the cult's movements so the PCs can continue to track the treasure train. But that might be better left to more influential faction agents. Perhaps that can just be something that Leosin and Ontharr mention in passing - "We'll get some of our established agents in Baldur's Gate to smooth things over with the powers-that-be so they don't accidentally tip off the cultists and disrupt the flow of treasure heading north."

Aside from Leosin, who spent some time as a prisoner of the cultists, the PCs are the only ones likely to recognize any of the cultists from the camp near Greenest, so it'll be their job to keep an eye on the people passing through Blackgate. But they could also potentially hang out in some other places, like The Blushing Mermaid, in hopes of catching a glimpse of a familiar face there.

 

[pukunui]

Something else about which I'm unsure is how the PCs are going to recognize the cultists when they come to Blackgate to purchase wagons and such. The reason is that my group did not mingle with the cultists in the camp during Episode 2. Only one PC went into the camp under cover of darkness to rescue Leosin. So I'm not sure that any of the PCs *would* recognize any of the cultists from the camp. Nor would they be likely to recognize any of the cultists from the raid on Greenest, since that took place in the dark of night as well.

On top of that, the text on page 33 states that "Nothing identifies the cult's wagons as anything but typical merchants hauling northbound freight." Which makes me think that the PCs *shouldn't* be able to identify the cultists when they first show up. But if they don't - or can't - identify them, how do they know when it's time to leave?

I wonder if maybe I should take the vignettes from the caravan trip that I like and sprinkle them into the trip from Greenest to Elturel, and from Elturel to Baldur's Gate instead, and then skip the actual trip from Baldur's Gate to Waterdeep. Maybe they can just take a boat or even get access to a teleportation circle. Steve and Wolfgang's reasoning for including the caravan trip was to give the players a "tour of the Realms" before they go about saving it, but to be honest - the part of the Realms they're getting a tour of is pretty empty. It's not like they're going through Cormyr and the Dalelands or through the Silver Marches or somewhere a bit more iconic. They're mostly just going through shapeless wilderness.


EDIT: On a side note, I was also thinking about how Elturgard's second sun helps keep undead at bay and how it would be more fun to show the players that rather than just tell them. I'm imaging a sort of LOTR-style "flight to the ford" scene, where the PCs are chased by undead until they get within Elturgard's borders and discover that the light stops the undead from following them.

I'm not sure how feasible that would be, though.

 

[Dkase]

Something else about which I'm unsure is how the PCs are going to recognize the cultists when they come to Blackgate to purchase wagons and such. The reason is that my group did not mingle with the cultists in the camp during Episode 2. Only one PC went into the camp under cover of darkness to rescue Leosin. So I'm not sure that any of the PCs *would* recognize any of the cultists from the camp. Nor would they be likely to recognize any of the cultists from the raid on Greenest, since that took place in the dark of night as well.

You could slip some references from the cult into one of the other adventures. Maybe some of the villains or disposable minions have been approached by the cult with an offer for employment? Upon searching the dead body they find a letter from one of other Cult Heads (maybe Mondath or Langderossa) that informs them that they are supposed to meet Bog Luck at the Carnath road house and ask him about the 'Swamp Job' and that he will direct them from their? This way the PCs skip the caravan chapter, and can move on to the meat of the adventure again.

EDIT: On a side note, I was also thinking about how Elturgard's second sun helps keep undead at bay and how it would be more fun to show the players that rather than just tell them. I'm imaging a sort of LOTR-style "flight to the ford" scene, where the PCs are chased by undead until they get within Elturgard's borders and discover that the light stops the undead from following them.

I'm not sure how feasible that would be, though.

It's always a gamble when you want the PCs to run from anything with out them muttering 'rail road' under their breath. Having an NPC that's already aware of the Sun's effects on the undead could help a little. As they are beset by the undead, they yell, "We just need to make it over the next hill! The Gift of Aumanatar will protect us!" Hopefully, your players will take the hint.

 

[pukunui]

You could slip some references from the cult into one of the other adventures.

That certainly won't be hard to do, considering that DDEX1-1 is from the Tyranny of Dragons AL season.

Perhaps they find a note about taking the loot through the crypt, and so the PCs actually go and investigate that on their own, rather than having someone come and ask them to look into it. That would certainly give the players some more agency in that respect.

I don't want to give too much away about the roadhouse and Castle Naerytar, though. I'll leave that for them to find out about when they get to Waterdeep.

It's always a gamble when you want the PCs to run from anything with out them muttering 'rail road' under their breath.

Indeed. That's why I'm not sure how feasible an idea it is.

Having an NPC that's already aware of the Sun's effects on the undead could help a little. As they are beset by the undead, they yell, "We just need to make it over the next hill! The Gift of Aumanatar will protect us!" Hopefully, your players will take the hint.

Yes, that could do. Perhaps I could have Leosin ride with them from Greenest, rather than leave ahead of them. Still ... I'm not sure what kind of undead I'd use or why. I could have a bunch of wraiths attack them randomly, I suppose.


Anyway, I'm kind of liking where I'm going with this:

1) Greenest to Elturel: Perhaps Leosin leaves one of his acolytes behind in Greenest, and the PCs travel to Elturel with them. If they go straight across the Greenfields, rather than taking the long way around via Berdusk and Scornubel, then maybe they stumble into some old barrow mounds and get attacked by some wraiths ... and the NPC can suggest they ride fast for the borders of Elturgard in order to be safe. I can do a little wilderness chase scene or something, although wraiths probably can't move as fast as horses. I'll have to check on that.

2) Elturel: I *might* run the "Lightning Spell" mission in a tavern here. Otherwise I'll just have them meet up with Leosin and Ontharr. They can get into some physical rough and tumble with Ontharr before they get down to business.

3) Elturel to Baldur's Gate: They can maybe join up with a small caravan heading along the road that runs parallel to the river. I can run some of the vignettes like Fungus Humongous and maybe Payback - with the Harper agent they rescue becoming their main contact in the Gate, during their stay there.

4) Baldur's Gate: I can run the "Dragon Egg" and "Secret Prison" missions in the Outer City. Instead of the Welcomers, the bandits in the former can be members of the Guild, while I can replace the Black Fists in the latter with renegade Flaming Fist soldiers. I'm pondering maybe also adapting DDEX2-10 Cloaks and Shadows and having the assassin Little Wing working for the Cult of the Dragon instead of the Cult of the Howling Hatred. I can have him frame the PCs so that the Watch/Flaming Fists are after them, and then they can find some evidence that points them towards the "Xandria's Crypt" mission, where they discover the teleportation circle. Perhaps there are some notes in there indicating that the loot has been transported to Waterdeep.

5) Baldur's Gate to Waterdeep: The PCs will then need to get in touch with a faction contact and see if they can get access to another teleportation circle so they can keep on the cultists' trail. Once in Waterdeep, I can have them find out that the cultists have joined up with the roadwork caravan.

 

[jedijon]

Dragon sequence establishing episode #1 = flashback. Try roleplaying it like it already happened.

Not everything needs a present tense description. You can choose whether you want the flashback as scene 1, or start elsewhere with a teaser (think the prologue of A Game of Thrones), then join the characters in an aftermath description of your choice...and give the players a chance to join you there; via their heroic descriptions and dice mediated recollections..."no, it didn't happen like that". Thanks Prince of Persia 2008!

 

[jayoungr]

The thing about Baldur's Gate is that the PCs aren't likely to go back there for the entire rest of Tyranny of Dragons, so whatever happens there has to be self-contained.

Whatever you do there, I recommend letting the PCs meet some of the NPCs who will later be on the caravan (if you run the caravan trip). You can start establishing bonds, and it allows them to meet the NPCs in small groups.

By the way, can those DDEX adventures be found online anywhere? I'd love to have a look at them. (EDIT: Found them, and I just realized that I'm playing in a campaign based loosely on them--the first adventure looks quite familiar. So I'd better not read them until later, I guess!)

Something else about which I'm unsure is how the PCs are going to recognize the cultists when they come to Blackgate to purchase wagons and such. The reason is that my group did not mingle with the cultists in the camp during Episode 2. Only one PC went into the camp under cover of darkness to rescue Leosin. So I'm not sure that any of the PCs *would* recognize any of the cultists from the camp. Nor would they be likely to recognize any of the cultists from the raid on Greenest, since that took place in the dark of night as well.

My group had the same situation (they completely blew it when we ran through chapter 2, and Leosin had to escape on his own). Here's how I ran it:

1. I borrowed Mike Shea's suggestion of having an encounter with the cultists in between chapter 3 and chapter 4. He suggested having it happen between the bandit camp and Greenest, but I didn't read his entry until my group was already in Elturel; so I had them encounter a barge that had run aground on a sandbank on the river instead. They found the letter from Rezmir in the leader's pack.

2. In Baldur's Gate, they visited Aravax Foxtraveler's place of business posing as cultists and got him to tell them how the treasure was traveling north. This was important because up till then, they didn't know whether it was going by land or by sea. (They had found a map in Frulam Mondath's office with an arrow going west from Greenest and pointing up the coast, so they already knew it was going north, but he could also have confirmed that for them if they didn't know.)

3. I said there was only one caravan per tenday going north to Waterdeep; it takes that long to assemble enough wagons to make it defensible. There were several ways they could be sure they were joining the same caravan as the treasure. Ontharr and Leosin guessed how long it would take the cultists to reach Baldur's Gate from the bandit camp traveling overland. The letter from Rezmir confirmed that the treasure was split up and transported in different ways (including by cart). Also, Aravax Foxtraveler was making contact with the cultists as they arrived in Baldur's Gate, so he knew when most of them would be ready to leave. But they could reasonably expect for there to be some stragglers, so if the PCs caught a later caravan, there could still be treasure and cultists in it.

I wonder if maybe I should take the vignettes from the caravan trip that I like and sprinkle them into the trip from Greenest to Elturel, and from Elturel to Baldur's Gate instead, and then skip the actual trip from Baldur's Gate to Waterdeep. Maybe they can just take a boat or even get access to a teleportation circle.

The caravan trip was a real highlight of HotDQ for my group. A great deal of roleplaying happened during that part, and they made NPC friends and enemies that continued well past the journey itself. I think the fact that they were "cooped up" with the same group for an extended length of time was a major factor in this, as it gave them the chance to really get to know those NPCs in depth. So I urge you not to write it off just because it doesn't sound too exciting on paper. I think it plays better than it reads. That said, it includes a lot of incidents, so there's no reason you couldn't move some of them to an earlier part of the story.

 

[pukunui]

The thing about Baldur's Gate is that the PCs aren't likely to go back there for the entire rest of Tyranny of Dragons, so whatever happens there has to be self-contained.

Indeed. I'm going to let them do a bit of exploring on their own and also run one or two self-contained mini-adventures.

Whatever you do there, I recommend letting the PCs meet some of the NPCs who will later be on the caravan (if you run the caravan trip). You can start establishing bonds, and it allows them to meet the NPCs in small groups.

This too.

1. I borrowed Mike Shea's suggestion of having an encounter with the cultists in between chapter 3 and chapter 4. He suggested having it happen between the bandit camp and Greenest, but I didn't read his entry until my group was already in Elturel; so I had them encounter a barge that had run aground on a sandbank on the river instead. They found the letter from Rezmir in the leader's pack.

I've seen that before. I don't think I'll do that simply because I don't think it makes sense in the context of my campaign.

2. In Baldur's Gate, they visited Aravax Foxtraveler's place of business posing as cultists and got him to tell them how the treasure was traveling north. This was important because up till then, they didn't know whether it was going by land or by sea. (They had found a map in Frulam Mondath's office with an arrow going west from Greenest and pointing up the coast, so they already knew it was going north, but he could also have confirmed that for them if they didn't know.)

Who is Aravax Foxtraveler?

3. I said there was only one caravan per tenday going north to Waterdeep; it takes that long to assemble enough wagons to make it defensible.

Yeah, that makes sense. I might also have that Selebon guy make mention of the fact that someone hidden in a palanquin (but with a husky female voice) placed an order for three wagons and paid in cash. I got that from a play-by-post I found. That could be a good clue. I don't think I want the PCs to actually see Rezmir's palanquin themselves - like the adventure suggests - because I think they'd be inclined to get a bit trigger-happy. It's a common enough theme to have the BBEG always be one tantalizing step ahead of the protagonists right until the very end, after all.

The caravan trip was a real highlight of HotDQ for my group. A great deal of roleplaying happened during that part, and they made NPC friends and enemies that continued well past the journey itself. I think the fact that they were "cooped up" with the same group for an extended length of time was a major factor in this, as it gave them the chance to really get to know those NPCs in depth. So I urge you not to write it off just because it doesn't sound too exciting on paper. I think it plays better than it reads. That said, it includes a lot of incidents, so there's no reason you couldn't move some of them to an earlier part of the story.

I decided I'd go ahead with it after all.

Last session, my players voted to take the scenic route to Elturel. I had some griffons attack their horses on the Uldoon Trail a day out from Greenest. And then when they were almost to Berdusk, they encounterd one of that city's patrols coming the other way - in the Episode 2 setup, the young monk Nesim mentions that one of his brothers went to Berdusk to seek help but that it would be many days before any help arrived. I think the adventure assumes that most PC groups will head due north across the Greenfields, but since my players were heading towards Berdusk, I figured it made sense to let them see that someone was indeed coming to help.

I used my Forgotten Realms Adventures and Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast books to flesh out Berdusk and Scornubel a bit. The PCs took a barge down the Chionthar. I had them get attacked by gnolls in the night on a stretch of river that drew close to the Reaching Wood (the 4e FRCG mentions that the paladins of Elturgard barricaded the Reaching Wood, with the end result being that the resident gnolls slaughtered or enslaved all the other races within its confines, including the local elves).

The party only just docked in Elturel when we finished last session.

One thing I'm thinking of doing is including a member of the Emerald Enclave (possibly Delaan Winterhound himself) in the meeting with Ontharr and Leosin so the druid PC can have the opportunity to join that organization early on instead of having to wait until much, much later. I'm also thinking of letting the PCs meet Ulder Ravengard while in Baldur's Gate and have him extend an invitation to join the Lords' Alliance.

I kind of have a feel for which faction would best fit which PC already:
LG Noble Fighter: Lords' Alliance
LG Dwarf Wizard: Harpers
CG Elf Rogue: Harpers
N Goliath Druid: Emerald Enclave