D&D 5E What classes do you want added to 5e?

[Tony Vargas]

Yeah, Monk and Battlemaster aren't what I'd regard as being complex. They tend to have a best action for their uses of ki points/maneuvers - and the only real way around that is to burn them faster.

Not even Monk. Hm....

A Battlemaster who could use a maneuver every round of every combat might get interesting - do a different one each round and have more chance of success - keep repeating a maneuver and have less chance might get interesting. So try to keep tripping someone and you're better than someone untrained in doing so, but on the 2nd attempt, the other guy might have advantage on the saving throw.

That's sounding more like PF, where you get CMB & CMD so your fighter actually can get particularly good at combat options. Can't see anything like that in 5e, it'd break Bounded Accuracy to pieces.

Having a menu of maneuvers - combat tricks - that get less effective or harder to pull off isn't a bad idea, but it does come with some bookkeeping overhead (but you /want/ complexity, so there you go).

How else would this hypothetical class differ from fighter? Still durable? Still multi-attacking for high DPR?

 

[MwaO]

Since I don't see those as being "extremely" vague, would you mind giving an example of the kind of answer you seek? Because "what a character does" is, itself, a fairly vague question. To be clear, I don't mean give an answer *for* MwaO, just give an example answer of a thing you would expect a particular class (hypothetical or otherwise) to "do."

Well as an example, a 13th level caster has 7 levels of spell slots. You could choose to use just 1 spell if you really wanted to, but it gets really hard to not use at least 7 different spells all the time and probably there's another 5-6 or so that you can use most of the time. There likely isn't a real 'best' choice that works the same way in each combat. And there's probably a player or two capable of using all 18 different spells all the time.

i.e. all casters(except low-level Warlocks) have a mechanic that forces them to make interesting choices or being less powerful. I'd like to see a non-caster with a mechanic that functions similarly - make interesting, different choices or be less effective in combat.

 

[ChrisCarlson]

Since I don't see those as being "extremely" vague, would you mind giving an example of the kind of answer you seek? Because "what a character does" is, itself, a fairly vague question. To be clear, I don't mean give an answer *for* MwaO, just give an example answer of a thing you would expect a particular class (hypothetical or otherwise) to "do."

Really? Huh.

So what kind of buffing? Strength bonuses to allies is a buff? Psychic damage resistance? Are those the kinds of buffs the character should have access to?

Healing how? Regen aura? Bonus action healer's kit use? Something else? I'm surprised you don't think "healing" is extremely vague considering the numerous methods and varied options available already found in the PHB.

And what is battlefield control really, anyway? Other than buzz words. Like a dominate monster spell? That certainly accomplishes "control on the battlefield".

 

[MwaO]

Having a menu of maneuvers - combat tricks - that get less effective or harder to pull off isn't a bad idea, but it does come with some bookkeeping overhead (but you /want/ complexity, so there you go).

How else would this hypothetical class differ from fighter? Still durable? Still multi-attacking for high DPR?

I think it would work with Fighter as is. You get one maneuver per round period. At higher level, you can get it to work with your action surge for a 2nd use. If you used the maneuver in that combat already and the target saw it in use, the die value gets halved and/or they get advantage on the saving throw.

The regular Battlemaster has the advantage of being able to use the same maneuver repeatedly and more than once in a round. This guy has more overall uses of maneuvers, but has to use more variety to have the same rough capabilities.

 

[ChrisCarlson]

Well as an example, a 13th level caster has 7 levels of spell slots. You could choose to use just 1 spell if you really wanted to, but it gets really hard to not use at least 7 different spells all the time and probably there's another 5-6 or so that you can use most of the time. There likely isn't a real 'best' choice that works the same way in each combat. And there's probably a player or two capable of using all 18 different spells all the time.

i.e. all casters(except low-level Warlocks) have a mechanic that forces them to make interesting choices or being less powerful. I'd like to see a non-caster with a mechanic that functions similarly - make interesting, different choices or be less effective in combat.

Not to sound too on-the-nose, but aren't you taking about the battlemaster fighter? Maneuver dice are like spell slots in a way. And the their maneuver choices are their known spell. A 7th-level BMF (taking the Martial Adept feat) can know an impressive 7 maneuvers. He also has a whopping 6 maneuver dice that reset after every rest. Seems pretty good to me.

 

[ChrisCarlson]

I think it would work with Fighter as is. You get one maneuver per round period. At higher level, you can get it to work with your action surge for a 2nd use. If you used the maneuver in that combat already and the target saw it in use, the die value gets halved and/or they get advantage on the saving throw.

The regular Battlemaster has the advantage of being able to use the same maneuver repeatedly and more than once in a round. This guy has more overall uses of maneuvers, but has to use more variety to have the same rough capabilities.

Your previous post points to spellcasters as being flexible, varied in ability, and something to envy for your martial idea. Then you take away the cost mechanics associated with all spellcasting classes by giving the proposed idea unlimited access to bennies. I can help but get caught up in the disconnect.

 

[Tony Vargas]

So a Fighter sub-class or Battlemaster variation. Instead of short-rest recharge CS dice, you can do one maneuver per round? If a maneuver were an action (precluding multiple attacks entirely), or 'cost' a certain number of attacks, you could justify it being more dramatic/powerful, in spite of being 'at will.' And, of course, you could also have mechanisms for enemies to get wise to it. Disadvantage after the first time you use it would be straightforward. INT save each time you use it, with a declining DC, on success the victim figures it out, and the maneuver can't be used on them again, would require more tracking. Both would create some tactical interest from the need to avoid just spamming one 'best' maneuver.

 

[MwaO]

Not to sound too on-the-nose, but aren't you taking about the battlemaster fighter? Maneuver dice are like spell slots in a way. And the their maneuver choices are their known spell. A 7th-level BMF (taking the Martial Adept feat) can know an impressive 7 maneuvers. He also has a whopping 6 maneuver dice that reset after every rest. Seems pretty good to me.

There's a straightforward reason why I'm casting a 4th level spell in a 4th level spell slot - it is likely better or more interesting than casting a 3rd level spell in that 4th level spell slot. But at the same time, I simply don't have the option of casting a 4th level spell in a 3rd level spell slot.

Every caster who can cast 4th level spells is literally forced to choose a good 3rd and good 4th level spell to use and which they'll use every day. They simply don't really have a choice unless they want to spam the same 1st level spell repeatedly. Which is a choice, but an obviously bad one. And spells tend to rewrite the universe and are often changeable from day to day.

Battlemaster? Maneuvers are all of the same rough power level. There's nothing stopping a Battlemaster from picking 1-2 maneuvers and repeatedly using them at every opportunity. They're locked in once picked and tend to be a little extra tagged onto 1-4 attacks or some sort of reaction. They can easily run out unless they deliberately space out the uses, even at high level. And if your DM decides that today is not a short rest day, you can easily be out of options for the rest of the day.

 

[ChrisCarlson]

So select interesting and varied maneuvers which in turn allows you to make interesting and varied choices, I guess?

And maneuver dice do go up in "slot power". Their die size increases.

 

[Jabborwacky]

Mechanically, I'd want a summoner base class. Something with a custom companion like the Eidolon offered by the summoner in Pathfinder.

As for thematically, I'd like some psychic related classes. Stuff that provides psionics, but lends flexibility to the more creepy occult archetypes found in settings like Ravenloft (i.e. seers with their crystal balls, spirit mediums, and mentalists) as much as the more sci-fi inspired archetypes of dark sun (i.e. the traditional psion and psychic warrior).