D&D 5E Monster Conversion: The Immolith

[Quickleaf]

I remember being impressed by this piece of art...

Surely an amazing story had to be behind this demon! Right?

In the 4e Monster Manual the immolith is described as an undead demon resulting from the deaths of many demons at the same time and their spirits unpredictably fusing together. They despise the living and hang with undead. That's pretty much it. Miserable lore.

But the mechanics, even if a bit clunky and disconnected from the narrative, are interesting. And darn that image has really spoken to me and my current campaign involving the Brotherhood of True Flame (from Al-Qadim)!

[SBLOCK=4e Immolith stats & analysis]

It can attack with a claw that sets you on fire. And only during its turn (not on opportunity attacks) it can claw you, grab you, pull you next to it, and deprive your fire resistance. The need to differentiate this basic melee attack from a non-basic melee attack was because of 4e's "infinite opportunity attacks" rule. Then it gets a choice each round between two minor actions (or in 4e it could take both minor actions by forgoing its move IIRC): Deathfire Curse or Vigor of the Grave. Hmm. Deathfire Curse slows you and then lights you on fire – what the heck is happening narratively here? Fire slows you down? You're smoking then you catch on fire? Who knows! And Vigor of the Grave applies to undead...but again narratively what is going on? Is the immolith healing "with fire"? If that's the case why couldn't a fire elemental be healed?[/SBLOCK]

Reimagine this Monster! Ok, I need to reimagine the immolith's lore first...probably starting with the name's similarity to "immolate" which means "to kill or offer as a sacrifice, especially by burning."

[SECTION]An immolith is created when multiple fiends are destroyed and their essence is sent to the Plane of Fire instead of to the Lower Planes. Cults devoted to the demon lord Alzrius, the Archduke Belial and Archducess Fierna, Kossuth, and Imix; efreeti warlocks; the Red Wizards of Thay; and the Brotherhood of True Flame will undertake the ritual required to create such a deadly servitor. Bound by its creator’s magic, the immolith brings sacrificial offerings to the cult even as it seeks a way to escape the magic binding its torturous existence. An immolith speaks with the voices of each of the fiends comprising its nature simultaneously, though only rarely can an immolith remember its former identities.[/SECTION]

Idea Brainstorm! That's a pretty decent backstory, and it divorces the immolith from being a collection of demon essences. Really there was nothing especially demonic about the immolith to begin with. This allows for the essences of demons, devils, yugoloths, and other fiends to be smashed together into an unwilling melded consciousness. It certainly gives immoliths a context. Unlike the shadow demon (which also is created when a demon's essence can't return to the Abyss), the immolith provides greater detail – it doesn't just happen, it's brought into being by diabolists/demonologists/flame mages!

I'm picturing a paladin and his party having slaughtered scores of fiends at the climax of an adventure seeking a way to prevent the fiends from returning to the Lower Planes and reforming. Luckily the rogue has a lamp holding an efreeti who is only too happy to help... Little do they realize that the fiends are molded into an immolith by the efreet!

Or a fiend the PCs need information from has been merged into the melded consciousness of an immolith by Red Wizards, and they need to devise a way to speak with (or free) just that one fiend.

Or they encounter an immolith guarding giant black gates into a secret lair, and the immolith follows the letter of its creator's command, but only the letter. Players who've paid attention to the lore can use this to outfox the creator's commands, much to the immolith's delight. It will gleefully remind them not to seek out its creator on the fourth story bedchamber behind the second door on the right, and certainly not to harm him using powerful magic to penetrate his globe of invulnerability.

Design Notes.

• Stronger than a vrock (CR 6), weaker than a marilith (CR 16). Probably around CR 8 to 12.
• Its flaming aura is practically the same as the 5e balor's Fire Aura. How to differentiate?
• It looks kinda like a fire elemental, but I want to differentiate it from the fire elemental's Fire Form trait.
• Feeling like emphasizing "dark unearthly fire" as a theme might fit the art and concept better. Thinking on how to incorporate that.
• Vigor of the Dead feels too limited for my conception of the immolith. Need to expand that so it can benefit cultists and fire elementals. Also does it really need to be an action? It could just be a trait that kicks in when the immolith kills a creature...very "sacrifical offering" vibe.
• How to handle a lot of minor actions? What if it has multiattack (4 claw attacks), and can sacrifice claw attacks to gain bonus actions (possibly breaking normal rule of 1/turn)? Then I could give it a list of bonus actions like deathfire gaze, fiery grab, grasping spectral claws...
• Ooo, what if an immolith works sort of like a living portal to the fiery places (like the Plane of Fire, Phlegethos, Gehenna, Carnaxius, etc.) ? That could be very interesting and makes sense with my immolith lore...the constituent fiends are constantly trying to pull the immolith apart in different directions...sort of like how ghosts reenact their death by returning to the scene...

 

[Quickleaf]

First Draft. Here's my first stab at converting the immolith. I made some decisive moves such as divorcing its slowing ability from its gaze attack (Deathfire Curse in 4e), but then I gave it a simple "slowing" ability with Grasping Spectral Claws. The narrative maps better that way. I also really pushed the design by causing the immolith to transport creatures it reduces to 0 hit points to the Plane of Fire! Yikes! The only thing I'm not convinced on yet is the Ashen Aura...which is just a weak version of the balor's Fire Aura. It's true to the 4e immolith stat block, but isn't as unique as I'd like.

Look forward to your critical feedback.

 

[ehenning]

As it has clear undead characteristics, you could add/substitute in some necrotic damage to its Fire Aura.

 

[Dualazi]

Some thoughts, in no particular order of importance:

Your fiery grab looks like it works well, but it's not clarified if the Immolith gains extra bonus actions from having people held, since it's not making the additional claw attacks. It sounds pedantic (and is) but I could see nitpicking being made over it.

The fire damage seems cripplingly low. That's (sort of) alright, given that enemies will probably take some retribution damage from multiattack in melee, but at level 8-9 (when I could see players fighting one) ongoing 3 is just pitiful, and unless they're grabbed then fire resistance might still apply, dropping it to 1 damage.

Continuing from the above point, at AC 11 and 147 hp, this thing is going to get smoked before that aura has any chance to be a threat. In my opinion, auras really work best as high damage threats to keep PCs off enemy casters/artillery, or as low damage pressure from tanky foes. This does neither really.

My suggestion would be to ramp up the aura significantly and reduce the claw damage somewhat, since you want the fantasy of a controller of sorts who slows the player's movement and then drags them to fiery doom, and it makes the melee characters a little more cautious about capitalizing on that ridiculously low AC. As it stands currently I'd just ignore more of its mechanics and spam quad attacks to get some damage in before it drops.

Another potential suggestion (although not drawn from its 4e statblock) would be to give it stacking regen when enemies are affected by Deathsmoke Gaze. That would justify the low damage and make players have to deal with a sort of opt-in self CC if they want to cut down on the healing or burn through it.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

I just don't understand a creature that is a living (or unliving) inter-dimensional portal, especially if it can only teleport corpses. The whole thing is so far out of left field that I can't really parse it.

 

[Quickleaf]

Thanks for your comments Dualazi!

Your fiery grab looks like it works well, but it's not clarified if the Immolith gains extra bonus actions from having people held, since it's not making the additional claw attacks. It sounds pedantic (and is) but I could see nitpicking being made over it.

Yep, sustained grapples are supposed to reduce claw attacks, which reduces bonus actions.

The fire damage seems cripplingly low. That's (sort of) alright, given that enemies will probably take some retribution damage from multiattack in melee, but at level 8-9 (when I could see players fighting one) ongoing 3 is just pitiful, and unless they're grabbed then fire resistance might still apply, dropping it to 1 damage.

Continuing from the above point, at AC 11 and 147 hp, this thing is going to get smoked before that aura has any chance to be a threat. In my opinion, auras really work best as high damage threats to keep PCs off enemy casters/artillery, or as low damage pressure from tanky foes. This does neither really.

My suggestion would be to ramp up the aura significantly and reduce the claw damage somewhat, since you want the fantasy of a controller of sorts who slows the player's movement and then drags them to fiery doom, and it makes the melee characters a little more cautious about capitalizing on that ridiculously low AC. As it stands currently I'd just ignore more of its mechanics and spam quad attacks to get some damage in before it drops.

Right, the 4e immolith's stats make it a melee controller. Not really tanky, not really a caster/artillery. It was designed to pull PCs into its aura and cook them, while vexing artillery/caster PCs with its Deathfire Curse (lightning them on fire and slowing them). You nailed its function: dragging the PCs to a fiery doom. So I can just borrow the balor's 3d6 damage Fire Aura.

I was hesitant to do that for two reasons:
(1) The balor is a CR 19 monster leagues more difficult than the immolith, so I assumed there was a reason that was the only creature in the MM with such a damaging aura was CR 19.
(2) It's obviously stealing a feature from the balor, something I usually only do in when there's an obvious relationship between two monsters (e.g. designing a variant yuan-ti, I would probably give it poison immunity, innate spellcasting, and magic resistance).

About its AC 11: I was using the fire elemental (whose AC of 13 is derived just from Dex) as a guideline. Generally in 4e all ability scores are exaggerated – for example a 4e vrock has 19 Dex whereas a 5e vrock has 15 Dex. Similarly, the 4e firelasher elemental has Dex 21 whereas the 5e fire elemental has Dex 17.
There is no precise formula in WotC's conversion document beyond "if an ability score is over 20, drop it to 20" which is pretty useless, so it's up to my instinct and educated guess. The 4e immolith has a Dex of 16, so it's safe to say that its 5e version will have a lower Dex given what can be inferred from the vrock & fire elemental. So a Dex of 12 or 13 would be reasonable, which is what I did.

Another potential suggestion (although not drawn from its 4e statblock) would be to give it stacking regen when enemies are affected by Deathsmoke Gaze. That would justify the low damage and make players have to deal with a sort of opt-in self CC if they want to cut down on the healing or burn through it.

Interesting idea, and definitely in keeping with the concept! What's CC stand for? I'm not up on the lingo.

I just don't understand a creature that is a living (or unliving) inter-dimensional portal, especially if it can only teleport corpses. The whole thing is so far out of left field that I can't really parse it.

You seem to have a penchant for focusing on one thing you dislike or don't understand, and then throwing out the baby with the bath water. Still I'll do my best to address your comment...

Rather than thinking of it as a perfect instantaneous portal, think of it like a hungering flame, a burning-in-the-fireplace process. We see the object burning, but in the fantasy it's actually slowly being consumed by the Plane of Fire. While it isn't yet wholly burned, it still has a chance of escape. However once it's burned up (represented by 0 hp), then it is at last drawn bodily into the Plane of Fire.

The way I see it is that a living creature is going to fight being pulled into a monster's space. In fact, the 5e rules usually make that impossible in the heat of combat (which is why some monsters like the fire elemental have traits allowing them to enter the spaces of enemies). Like the immolith itself, whose moment of death happened with it being sent to the Plane of Fire, the immolith enacts the same upon its foes.

Moreover, granting a creature the ability to send a living conscious creature to another plane qualifies as a "save or die" effect, or at least the same ballpark. 5e is careful with such effects; for example the sea hag's Death Glare will only reduce a creature to 0 hit points...so that the Dying rules then kick in...and the Medusa involves multiple saves vs. incremental petrification.

Think of this like incremental planeshifting, if that makes it easier.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I don't really like your bonus action use. Why don't you just make the spectral claws always on, the gaze a reaction (I don't know - when someone moves in or within 60 feet?) and the grasp an action swappable with claw attacks? No bonus actions needed.

Sent from my LG-D852 using EN World mobile app

 

[dave2008]

I think the action / bonus action economy is a little funky. i would suggest making fiery grab an action and let multiattack allow any combination of claw and fiery grab; or, just allow it to grapple the monster on a successful claw hit. There are several monsters in the MM that do this. Then you can have 2 bonus actions, though I would suggest sticking to 1 total / turn. So you get up to 5 actions per turn. You could also make on of the bonus actions a reaction instead. Maybe with a 4e flavor:

REACTIONS
Spectral Claws. When the immolith is reduced to 73 hit points or less it summons spectral claws from the ground in a 30-foot radius around it for 2(1d4) rounds. All creatures, except the immolith, within the area treat it as difficult terrain.

This way you can always use fiery grab with the claw attack (same action now), you can always use deathsmoke gaze (bonus action), and you are guaranteed one use of spectral claws. You could also make spectral claws an action and a reaction if that fits your fiction better (some people don't like an ability that can only be used as a reaction), since it is under powered it would probably only be used as a reaction, but it is still there if wanted - heck you could make it a multiattack option as well.

 

[Dualazi]

Thanks for your comments Dualazi!

No problem, hope it helps in some way.

Yep, sustained grapples are supposed to reduce claw attacks, which reduces bonus actions.

Right, the 4e immolith's stats make it a melee controller. Not really tanky, not really a caster/artillery. It was designed to pull PCs into its aura and cook them, while vexing artillery/caster PCs with its Deathfire Curse (lightning them on fire and slowing them). You nailed its function: dragging the PCs to a fiery doom. So I can just borrow the balor's 3d6 damage Fire Aura.

I was hesitant to do that for two reasons:
(1) The balor is a CR 19 monster leagues more difficult than the immolith, so I assumed there was a reason that was the only creature in the MM with such a damaging aura was CR 19.
(2) It's obviously stealing a feature from the balor, something I usually only do in when there's an obvious relationship between two monsters (e.g. designing a variant yuan-ti, I would probably give it poison immunity, innate spellcasting, and magic resistance).

It doesn't have to be the same value, it just has (in my opinion, of course) to be a threatening value. There's a fire demon in Tome of Beasts somewhere in that CR neighborhood and it has a fire aura of 2d10 IIRC, which seems like a better option for deterring/punishing close range engagements. As it stands my fear is that this horrible fiery monstrosity won't actually inspire fear in the players or a sense of urgency to escape its claws, and they'll just say "oh, is that it?" which always sucks from a DM viewpoint.

About its AC 11: I was using the fire elemental (whose AC of 13 is derived just from Dex) as a guideline. Generally in 4e all ability scores are exaggerated – for example a 4e vrock has 19 Dex whereas a 5e vrock has 15 Dex. Similarly, the 4e firelasher elemental has Dex 21 whereas the 5e fire elemental has Dex 17.
There is no precise formula in WotC's conversion document beyond "if an ability score is over 20, drop it to 20" which is pretty useless, so it's up to my instinct and educated guess. The 4e immolith has a Dex of 16, so it's safe to say that its 5e version will have a lower Dex given what can be inferred from the vrock & fire elemental. So a Dex of 12 or 13 would be reasonable, which is what I did.

My comment about the AC being low wasn't questioning your method of deriving it so much as it is me saying that this monster is very frail. Let's be real here, chances are if people have played any of the adventure paths or even just rolled loot randomly, by level 8-9 they will likely have some magic weapons, or spells/traits that fulfill that requirement in the place of actual gear. Point being, the damage resistance has a good chance in my opinion of not really being an issue, and 150~ hp and AC 11 do not a long lasting creature make. If bumping up either of those artificially isn't your cup of tea, then I would suggest adding an effect to the aura of heatwaves that distort vision, and give it an effect similar to mirror image or a displacer beast.

Interesting idea, and definitely in keeping with the concept! What's CC stand for? I'm not up on the lingo.

Crowd Control, basically anything that removes/reduces an enemy's ability to fight (usually) without damage.

 

[Quickleaf]

Thanks for your feedback, folks I've redesigned the immolith with an eye towards your suggestions:

• I got rid of the funky bonus action thing, instead making Grasping Spectral Claws an always active trait, making Deathsmoke Gaze a reaction, and integrating Fiery Grab into its multiattack more seamlessly.
• I bumped up its Fire Aura to 3d6 (same as a balor). I think this still keeps it a CR 9 monster, but not positive. I figure it's a frickin' fire fiend, and the balor is a bit underwhelming, so I'm ok just borrowing that trait wholesale.
• I added a provision to its Deathsmoke Gaze that reduces the target's visibility to just 10 feet, which can grant the immolith a small measure of protection given its low AC 11. It's not much, but combined with the 30 feet aura of difficult terrain it gives it a fighting chance.

Hopefully, this monster inspires a dread of "dragging PCs to their fiery doom."