Gotham - Forged in the Dark - Playbook Ideas (+)

I haven’t looked into this thread a ton (very good idea), but here is some input on archetype adversity within a specific theme:

1) Basic package (moves, dots, et al) that everyone gets.

2) Diversify via:

a) multiple xp triggers

b) Wide array of playbook moves (grab one at 1st and subsequent).
 

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Fenris-77

Small God of the Dozens
Supporter
I was hoping you'd show up in this thread eventually. (y) I want to add to the diversity of the playbooks. The abilities will be at least the same as S&V or BitD, and then I want to layer on powers and probably weaknesses. Figuring out XP triggers will be key, once I figure out exactly what the abilities, powers and whatnot look like.
 

I was hoping you'd show up in this thread eventually. (y) I want to add to the diversity of the playbooks. The abilities will be at least the same as S&V or BitD, and then I want to layer on powers and probably weaknesses. Figuring out XP triggers will be key, once I figure out exactly what the abilities, powers and whatnot look like.

Not frequenting the boards too much right now.

I’ll take a deeper look at the thread in the coming days and post some “Bladesey” thoughts about how to possibly construct classes/chassis and playbooks.
 


G

Guest 6801328

Guest
Just an idea for you (and maybe it's already in there; I'm only peripherally familiar with BitD)...after watching the first few seasons of Gotham, and a recurring trope that makes the show fun, I've been envisioning an RPG with this feature:
  1. You maintain a number of bonds with NPCs
  2. When you are in trouble, you can spend a resource that essentially lets you get lucky. So maybe you're hanging upside down in shackles, about to be dropped into the bay. You spend this resource, and another NPC intervenes to save you, or you remember that you have a paperclip in your pocket, or whatever.
  3. HOWEVER, the cost of doing that is that something happened to one of your bonds. So you escape, only to discover that somebody important to you is now in serious trouble.
 

hawkeyefan

Legend
@Fenris-77 Would some generic playbook abilities work? Like a list of abilities available to any playbook, but not specifically tied to any of them. I mean, that's kind of how all of them work given the veteran advance option, and I know you want to avoid a power list, but that may add some diversity and fill that "Power" category. Seems like it would be similar to the xeno abilities of S&V or the Advance Abilities and Permissions from Blades.

I think you're right that you have to consider Stress cost for ability use. It would seem to make sense for some abilities, but not others. But since power use would be expected to be pretty common, PCs may use up Stress far more quickly than in Blades. So Stress cost is probably something to consider on a case by case basis, some powers may have it and others may not. And maybe having some abilities that allow you to clear stress may also be a good idea.

For XP triggers, you thinking of following Blades with 3 uniform to all playbooks, and then 1 specific to each playbook?
 

Fenris-77

Small God of the Dozens
Supporter
I don't actually want to completely avoid a power list per se, I just want to avoid three pages of dense text describing every individual power in the known universe. I think once I have categories of power decided on, two or three example powers for each would be more than sufficient. I think the idea would be that some base mechanics are laid out, along with some examples, but after that its up to the player and GM to define the exact nature of the powers. That shouldn't be too much of a burden when its tag based, and I can steal some of the verbiage from CoM about overly broad tags and whatnot.

I suspect that powers will be a complete 'chapter' of the rules. I want that to be more about the narrative uses, setting how they function in play, and outlining progression during play, than about lists of actual powers. I really dig the division of powers in CoM into themes, and I think I want to steal that. There are 8 themes total, and that seems manageable, and has some nice symmetry with the number of playbooks. It's almost a 1-1 relationship between the playbooks and powers actually. Since you would be able to dip into more than one power that really opens up the variety in how characters get built.

On to stress. Yeah, I had thought that this seemed like a high stress-use kind of game. I'm not 100% sure how to manage that. I like compelling weaknesses in return for reduced stress, but I don't know if that will enough. It's not like anyone wants their glaring weakness coming up 4 or 5 times a job. One possibility is to lengthen the stress track a little, and another is to keep the stress costs down as much as possible. One way to reduce the stress use is to have basic power use not require it, but require it for 'souped up' actions. So you flaming fists add a die to melee, and you can burn a stress to have them also grant potency for the duration of combat. Something like that.

One thought I had along those lines is to add some dramatic tension to the game by having two mechanics that really pull the characters in different direction. Since we're talking villains, I think at least some of the XP triggers should be very personal and individual, and perhaps quite different from playbook to playbook. If, on the other hand, some of the mechanics for powers emphasized teamwork and cooperation to help mitigate or reduce stress, that could produce a nice push and pull between individual goals and team success. Especially if those system were purpose designed to work together to get the desired push and pull. I don't know if this exact example will provide the tension, but the more I think about the more I really want that tension in the game somewhere, somehow.

Specifically on XP, I'll say I'm not sure. The baseline is obviously Blades but that may change a little once the details start to emerge. One thing I'm considering is either decoupling XP from the attributes and make it more personal beliefs and mission state oriented, or keeping the attribute XP and extending it to powers somehow. Powers could simply be treated as additional attributes, but since they are used in conjunction with actions, where do you put the XP for desperate actions, on the attribute or Power XP track? The option I'm currently looking at the hardest is to keep attribute XP the way it is, but tie power XP to personal belief and goal type stuff. Generally, your actions get better from desperate use, and your powers get better by following through on your core drives and motivations.
 

Band of Blades has a shorter Stress track to emphasize the mortality of your soldiers.

Maybe Gotham can have a longer Stress track? Alternatively, maybe allow 4 or 5 Trauma max instead? With a correspondingly longer list of Traumas? That would be fitting for our damaged supervillains.
 

Fenris-77

Small God of the Dozens
Supporter
Yeah, a longer stress track might be in order for sure. I don't want things to get too gonzo though. I am going to include some mechanics for reducing stress, and its possible that not everything needs to work off stress either. Managing that resource is a key part of the game though, and I don't want to make too easy - players need to feel like they're being challenged. I think I need to lay out all the stress based mechanics side by each and see what it looks like. For example, with powers and tech, there may be less need to spend stress to resist in combat perhaps.

Another mechanic from CoM that I'm looking at is Burning Tags. You can burn a tag (that gets recovered in downtime) to add dice to a roll, or avoid consequences. So essentially giving up a portion of your power to not get dropped in the cacky. That could be something we can work with in addition to stress. At the very least I want to have some non-super power tags so that not everyone needs to be 'super'. There could be tech versions, and skill related tags. All sorts of options. They essentially work as free floating skills in CoM, which doesn't have named skills like BitD. That needs to change, but they certainly could work as specializations that add to skills in certain circumstances, much like we;ve discussed powers doing.

I don't want to fall too far down the tags rabbit hole. I really like the idea, but I'm still not 100% sure I can make it work with the BitD abilities and action pools.
 

Ratskinner

Adventurer
There's another PbtA supers game called Worlds in Peril. It has an interesting way of handling powers, that I think might be better suited to adaptation to the FitD engine.

Basically, you keep a "profile" of your powers, just a list of things you can do. You can use that profile as narration for what you do. So, you'd still be triggering the "scuffle" or "wreck" move, but you can use your superpowers as part of describing how you do it. Two general moves, "Burnout" and "Push" let you expand your power profile with different risks involved. So, if you want to use your freezey powers to cryogenically shatter a vault door, but you don't have anything like that in your profile, you might "Push" to do it and add it to your profile. Similarly, if you are in desperate straits and trying to use your freezy power to extinguish a burning building...you might be risking "Burnout". I feel like that's an easier route than trying to stack individual power moves into a FitD framework, plus it adds an organic growth method.
 

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