D&D General Two underlying truths: D&D heritage and inclusivity

[Maxperson]

I've posted these two previously twice, either or here or in the other two threads when people asked what was going on. They were posted at least a couple other times by other folks. I might have posted them more often, but at some point it feels repetitive. They aren't everyone's argument, but they're one of them.

Orcs, Britons, and the Martial Race Myth, Part I: A Species Built for Racial Terror — James Mendez Hodes

This is the first installment of a two-article series about the racist origins, nature, and ramifications of orcs, a malevolent humanoid species from English author John Ronald Reuel Tolkien’s Middle-earth fantasy setting. I started researching this article with the hypothesis that a collection of n

jamesmendezhodes.com

Orcs, Britons, and the Martial Race Myth, Part II: They're Not Human — James Mendez Hodes

This is the complement to my previous article , “Orcs, Britons, and the Martial Race Myth, Part I: A Species Built for Racial Terror.” In the previous article, we learned how racist myths from the British academy and army fueled JRR Tolkien’s creation of orcs as an analogue for Asian people. Today

jamesmendezhodes.com

Those aren't D&D orcs, though. D&D orcs and Tolkien orcs share a name and that's about it.

 

[Hussar]

Ok, @Maxperson - here's a writeup for Greyhawk orcs. Now, I realize it's not official, but, it does illustrate the point. Can you honestly say that you can read this: Orc and not see a single issue? Nothing that contains even the slightest squick value for you? Nothing at all?

 

[Hussar]

Those aren't D&D orcs, though. D&D orcs and Tolkien orcs share a name and that's about it.

Um, @Maxperson, please, for the love of little fishies, do some reading before making claims like this:

Lord of the Rings: Tolkien is, of course, the original source of orcs and their tribes.

From here: Gygaxian Orc Tribes

 

[Maxperson]

Ok, @Maxperson - here's a writeup for Greyhawk orcs. Now, I realize it's not official, but, it does illustrate the point. Can you honestly say that you can read this: Orc and not see a single issue? Nothing that contains even the slightest squick value for you? Nothing at all?

That was pretty bad, but what does an unofficial write-up have to do with this discussion? We're talking about the official write-up.

 

[Maxperson]

Um, @Maxperson, please, for the love of little fishies, do some reading before making claims like this:

From here: Gygaxian Orc Tribes

And? He took some tribe names. He grabbed the orc name and some tribe names from Tolkien, but changed them into pig people with a completely different history. D&D orcs are not Tolkien orcs.

 

[MichaelSomething]

Inherently evil races belong in D&D as much as Race-as-class, Gold for EXP, and Thaco

 

[Lanefan]

Inherently evil races belong in D&D as much as Race-as-class, Gold for EXP, and Thaco

What about inherently good races (e.g. non-Kender Hobbits); or inherently lawful (e.g. Dwarves), or inherently chaotic (e.g. Elves and Gnomes)? If inherent evil has to go (and I'm not at all convinced that it does) then by extension so must those other three - right?

 

[MichaelSomething]

What about inherently good races (e.g. non-Kender Hobbits); or inherently lawful (e.g. Dwarves), or inherently chaotic (e.g. Elves and Gnomes)? If inherent evil has to go (and I'm not at all convinced that it does) then by extension so must those other three - right?

"e.g. non-Kender Hobbits"?? Isn't that statement itself proof that races arn't monolithic?

 

[Lanefan]

"e.g. non-Kender Hobbits"?? Isn't that statement itself proof that races arn't monolithic?

I was making the distinction because far too often Kender get lumped in with Hobbits, where in my mind at least they're separate things.

 

[Sadras]

Slavery is not a laughing matter, but I found your claim that it still exists in the United States to be silly.

My wife is a reality show junkie and of late she has been hooked on RuPaul's Drag Race, which essentially means I get to see a lot of it too. In the season she is currently watching one of the South Korean contestants says (paraphrasing a little) - You guys in the states do not realise how good you have it
At which point one of the African American contestants replies So true, so true

Now this is not to downplay any bad things that do occur within the States - but it does mean that sometimes USAians do not realise the privileges they do have. Point being, I agree with you too - I find the comment silly.