D&D 5E The "Faster Features" Variant (+)

[Mistwell]

So back to the wizard, yes they don't get 9th level spells....but its not like every other classes is knocking it out of the park in power. They still have the power of 5th level spells, still get a lot of spell slots through their recovery, and now can casually throw around a 2nd level spell. That's solid, not mind blowing, but they didn't suddenly get dropped to the bottom of the pack either.

Not really talking about capstone abilities and I think this conversation keeps getting caught up on that topic rather than the normal every level abilities. If the wizard had a named ability at 11th level of "Contingency spell, once per day" it would be listed here in the Faster Variant features. That's not a capstone ability, it's their 11th level ability, which has been put into the spell list instead of a named ability. But it's their ability for that level nonetheless.

I really do think they should have higher level spell slots, without the spells known to match those slots, to help make up for what's missing here.

Forget about the capstone though. This thread isn't about capstones, and what's missing for the wizard isn't the capstone. It's the other level abilities which were buried in their spells.

 

[DND_Reborn]

My only note here is at level 5. 5th level in 5e is a game changing level. Casters gains 3rd level spells, which mark a sizable increase in their power and capabilities. Warriors get their 2nd attack, a doubling of their attack capabilities.

I think its important to keep that level as it is, both to give casters and warriors a roughly equal bump in strength at the same time, but also because this level already represents a major bump from the levels before it, and really doesn't need any more.

I would actually argue that most 6th level abilities could be moved to the 4th level instead of the extra attack and that would be "less powerful" than sliding the extra attack back.

I understand your logic but level 6 is a subclass feature level for many classes and putting it to level 4 would make it come right after many get their subclasses at level 3.

I am not as worried about keeping level 5 "as is". I would rather move that power level up to level 4. Extra Attack is given at level 4 (in the updated version I will post later tonight, so no longer level 3) and cantrips could scale at level 4 instead of 5 as well to keep caster attacks up a bit.

If it seems weird when we play-test it, we can discuss further alterations. Right now I am pretty happy with the current draft to test out. I'll update the OP in a couple hours if you want to check it out.

Thanks again for your words of caution.

 

[DND_Reborn]

UPDATE: The OP spoiler tables have all been updated for review. Thanks to all for your contributions, insights, and such!

Please comment as before with the new ideas. Play-testing will likely begin in the next two weeks or sooner.

 

[Stalker0]

Not really talking about capstone abilities and I think this conversation keeps getting caught up on that topic rather than the normal every level abilities. If the wizard had a named ability at 11th level of "Contingency spell, once per day" it would be listed here in the Faster Variant features. That's not a capstone ability, it's their 11th level ability, which has been put into the spell list instead of a named ability. But it's their ability for that level nonetheless.

...

Forget about the capstone though. This thread isn't about capstones, and what's missing for the wizard isn't the capstone. It's the other level abilities which were buried in their spells.

This is a fair point, the whole must be taken in order to fully evaluate whether the wizard is "missing out" compared to other classes. I agree, so lets try and look a little deeper.

First, a fundamental question must be asked: Are classes (before compression) balanced at 10th level?

Your answer to this question will flavor your thoughts on the discussion, so its important to consider. I will start from the position of "Yes, the classes are balanced".

So lets take a look at the "core 4" classes and see how they stack up to each other with this compression (aka what do they gain by 10th). This will help us make a direct comparison for debate. I am also going to select a common subclass for each. I think its way too easy to ignore subclass abilities (some of which are very good) in this debate, and subclasses are as core to the power of a class as the fundamental abilities are, so we cannot ignore them.

Wizard (Diviner)

• You roll three d20s for your Portent feature, rather than two.
• Auto Prepare 2 3rd level spells, cast each 1/short rest for free.
• Cast a 1st and 2nd level spell at will.
• +1 Arcane Recovery (which roughly translates to an extra 5th level spell per day).
• +4 to Arcana Checks
• Their spells impose disadvantage on counterspell checks.

Rogue (Thief)

• Minimum 10 roll on ability checks
• Detect Hidden or Invisible creatures within 10 feet
• +4 to Wisdom saving throws
• No attack has advantage against you unless incapacitated.
• One ability check becomes 20, or 1 missed attack becomes hit (1/short rest).
• You ignore all class, race, and level requirements on the use of magic items.
• You can take two turns during the first round of any combat. You take your first turn at your normal initiative and your second turn at your initiative minus 10. You can’t use this feature when you are surprised.
• ASI

Cleric (Life Domain)

• Destroy Undead (CR 2-4)
• +1 Channel Divinity per Rest (aka 50 HP of healing as an action or a Turn Undead)
• All Healing with spells is Maximized (aka 4d6 = 24)
• Can cast any 5th level Cleric or Domain spell 1/week

Fighter (Champion)

• Reroll saving throw (and must keep new result) 2/long rest
• +1 AC
• +1 to Saving Throws
• +1 Attack
• Crit on 18-20 (up from 19-20)
• If at half HP (and not 0), gain 5 + con mod in HP.
• ASI

 

[Stalker0]

UPDATE: The OP spoiler tables have all been updated for review. Thanks to all for your contributions, insights, and such!

Please comment as before with the new ideas. Play-testing will likely begin in the next two weeks or sooner.

My first note off the bat. I can say in my game already my players gripe about the fact that feats are only every 4 levels. The fact that many of your martial classes are getting their "feat" at 5th or even 6th level....even if its balanced on paper, is not going to have good mouthfeel to many players.

 

[DND_Reborn]

My first note off the bat. I can say in my game already my players gripe about the fact that feats are only every 4 levels. The fact that many of your martial classes are getting their "feat" at 5th or even 6th level....even if its balanced on paper, is not going to have good mouthfeel to many players.

Sorry, but I am a bit confused, the only martial class that gains extra feats is the fighter...

The feat progression is standard, the only caveat being the fighter and rogue who gain extra feats as their class features at those levels (which they gain already of course).

 

[Stalker0]

Sorry, but I am a bit confused, the only martial class that gains extra feats is the fighter...

The feat progression is standard, the only caveat being the fighter and rogue who gain extra feats as their class features at those levels (which they gain already of course).

Ah I misunderstood, thank you for the clarification.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Ah I misunderstood, thank you for the clarification.

No worries, I thought maybe I was misunderstanding something LOL!

 

[Maxperson]

Not really talking about capstone abilities and I think this conversation keeps getting caught up on that topic rather than the normal every level abilities. If the wizard had a named ability at 11th level of "Contingency spell, once per day" it would be listed here in the Faster Variant features. That's not a capstone ability, it's their 11th level ability, which has been put into the spell list instead of a named ability. But it's their ability for that level nonetheless.

I really do think they should have higher level spell slots, without the spells known to match those slots, to help make up for what's missing here.

Forget about the capstone though. This thread isn't about capstones, and what's missing for the wizard isn't the capstone. It's the other level abilities which were buried in their spells.

They still get their 6th level spell slot and spells at 11th level, though. That "Contingency spell, once per day" at 11th level is still there.

 

[Mistwell]

They still get their 6th level spell slot and spells at 11th level, though. That "Contingency spell, once per day" at 11th level is still there.

Yes. Which defeats the purpose of the thread, however.