D&D 5E Dark Sun Spiritual Successor on Kickstarter: Red Dawn: Into the Dawnlands

[humble minion]

I'm pretty much don't like it don't buy it.

Something like this though is a decent contrast to the sanitized boring stuff WotC has been making though. It's not one or the other for me options are good.

Which is what I'm doing. But (especially as someone who's a long time Dark Sun fan who's written many, many words on here about how I'd like a 5e Dark Sun to look), I think it's reasonable to talk about why I'm unlikely to buy/support a product that appears to be squarely aimed at people like me.

And for me, too often the flip side of people trying to contrast with 'sanitized boring stuff', is that you get overwhelmed with juvenile cheap shock value tactics in the name of edginess. I was buying RPGs in the late 90s, the spiral of game publishers continually trying to out-darkness and out-edginess World of Darkness and each other was a trend i personally got tired of a long time ago. Mind you, I'm not quite ready to write off the Red Dawn project as a case of that. But for me, If you're going to have horrible stuff in a game, make it meaningful, seriously engage what it might mean to people who've experienced it in real life, and remember that darkness needs some light for contrast.

 

[Zardnaar]

Which is what I'm doing. But (especially as someone who's a long time Dark Sun fan who's written many, many words on here about how I'd like a 5e Dark Sun to look), I think it's reasonable to talk about why I'm unlikely to buy/support a product that appears to be squarely aimed at people like me.

And for me, too often the flip side of people trying to contrast with 'sanitized boring stuff', is that you get overwhelmed with juvenile cheap shock value tactics in the name of edginess. I was buying RPGs in the late 90s, the spiral of game publishers continually trying to out-darkness and out-edginess World of Darkness and each other was a trend i personally got tired of a long time ago. Mind you, I'm not quite ready to write off the Red Dawn project as a case of that. But for me, If you're going to have horrible stuff in a game, make it meaningful, seriously engage what it might mean to people who've experienced it in real life people, and remember that darkness needs some light for contrast.

Sure I read the shorts ofthe Kickstarter. Doesn't seem overly edgy.

Apple doesn't fall far from the tree seems to be the big thing I noticed.

 

[Malmuria]

I think this thread got it about right:

 

[Dausuul]

This ... is probably not for me, on first viewing. I love Dark Sun, but just such a naked, transparent ripoff rubs me the wrong way a little, plus neither of the main authors listed seem to have any prior RPG design or writing credits whatsoever and this is the company's first KS, which always makes me a little wary. I've been bitten before.

Agreed.

And all the run-on sentences make me twitchy. I know this is overly nitpicky of me, but... still. I would not flat-out reject a book that was written like that, but it would annoy me significantly while reading.

 

[Charlaquin]

I think this thread got it about right:

In particular I love this bit:

“You can't get new converts to old ideas by keeping them ossified in outdated concepts. (…) You move forward by taking those old ideas and re-inventing them in a new way that is relevant and appropriate to more people. You create a new form that brings in a new audience. You take what's familiar and you make it relatable to more people.”

This is so incredibly true, and it’s why I tire of people obsessing over canon and continuity and decrying changes made to classic settings.

 

[Zardnaar]

In particular I love this bit:

“You can't get new converts to old ideas by keeping them ossified in outdated concepts. (…) You move forward by taking those old ideas and re-inventing them in a new way that is relevant and appropriate to more people. You create a new form that brings in a new audience. You take what's familiar and you make it relatable to more people.”

This is so incredibly true, and it’s why I tire of people obsessing over canon and continuity and decrying changes made to classic settings.

1. We know that's not true. Plenty of things have crash d and burned because it doesn't appeal to the old or new.

2. We don't know what their goals are or expectations.

They're not claiming bits a universal RPG or aimed at everyone.

It's essentially gatekeeping? Variety etc don't like it don't buy it it's fairly simple concept.

 

[TheSword]

This looks way too similar to Dark Sun... I don't know how I feel about it. I understand "inspiration", but this is just a copy/paste

I agree.
I love Athas, in fact I really love the setting and the style it tries to create.

I think fans creating a 5e update of dark sun is one thing. Whether official or unofficial. Athas.org did this for a long time and kept things alive.

This feels like a cheap way around the IP rights though. By changing just enough to make it different, and essentially copying the key elements of the world. Im not sure I’m comfortable with them making money off someone else’s work.

My preference is to wait until WOC do Darksun.

 

[Zardnaar]

I agree.
I love Athas, in fact I really love the setting and the style it tries to create.

I think fans creating a 5e update of dark sun is one thing. Whether official or unofficial. Athas.org did this for a long time and kept things alive.

This feels like a cheap way around the IP rights though. By changing just enough to make it different, and essentially copying the key elements of the world. Im not sure I’m comfortable with them making money off someone else’s work.

My preference is to wait until WOC do Darksun.

People gave accused them that they don't get Darksun.

It seems they get Darksun better than Fe. That grittiness is a key part of Darksun.

It wasn't designed as a nice world it's your PG14 or R16 world vs your G or PG realms.

 

[Mecheon]

It seems they get Darksun better than Fe. That grittiness is a key part of Darksun.

Dark Sun isn't all grit though. Its a world specifically ruined by the actions of a few, ruined by the action of one reaching towards the past he once knew and ruining the lives of thousands to try and get it. Its a world where the player characters are hope, to the point the first big adventure is specifically dethroning one of those people responsible and bringing back some more hope to the world. A world with great evil, but also great heroism to stand against it.

If all you have is a gritty setting with psionics, you don't have Dark Sun. You've just got a pale immitation.

 

[Zardnaar]

Dark Sun isn't all grit though. Its a world specifically ruined by the actions of a few, ruined by the action of one reaching towards the past he once knew and ruining the lives of thousands to try and get it. Its a world where the player characters are hope, to the point the first big adventure is specifically dethroning one of those people responsible and bringing back some more hope to the world. A world with great evil, but also great heroism to stand against it.

If all you have is a gritty setting with psionics, you don't have Dark Sun. You've just got a pale immitation.

And have you read the book in it's entirety?

You're comparing a few snippets vs post original DS boxed set.