Tonguez
A suffusion of yellow
both LotR and Narnia were spawned from a wager between friends a d was Dianetics written as an experiment?
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M.A.R. Barker, author of Tekumel, also author of Neo-Nazi book?
- Thread starter Ancalagon
- Start date
Parmandur
Book-Friend
Nah, the wager lead to the Planetary Trilogy from Lewis, and the post-humous "Lost Road" from Tolkien. And those both contained their actual ideas and beliefs, hardcore.
Dianetics is not a comparison that speaks well, si it...?
Defender_X
Explorer
I didn't realize he was a Muslim. Unlike Baker, I didn't change my name upon reversion. That being said, kinda hard not to be disappointed at hearing this. So I don't feel bad about not having any Tekumel books.
Parmandur
Book-Friend
He wasn't exactly mainstream in his religous expression or beliefs.
Ruin Explorer
Legend
Exactly this. It's profoundly unsurprising.
As for "he wrote it as a prank", whilst it's not impossible, and he seems to have had the personality for that sort of extreme shenanigans, I am somewhat skeptical, because there's a very close to 1:1 correlation between people who think it's funny to "pretend" to be Nazis frequently or on a long-term basis and people with fairly horrific/reprehensible views re: race, Judaism, etc.
Indeed the whole Nazi/Muslim thing isn't surprising either. Not because there's anything wrong with Islam, to be clear, but fringe-y people looking for a philosophy/way-to-live often latch on to one of those, or sequentially one then the other.
darjr
I crit!
It wasn’t a prank. I’m convinced of that now. Based on what I’ve seen reported. I have a tiny bit of hope it’s still all a mistake, a shrinking hope.
Seeing that he was part of a group bent on holocaust denial is bad enough all on its own.
But like I said, I hope it’s all untrue, and at this point it’d probably have to prove to be an elaborate conspiracy of a hoax in order for it to be untrue.
Seeing that he was part of a group bent on holocaust denial is bad enough all on its own.
But like I said, I hope it’s all untrue, and at this point it’d probably have to prove to be an elaborate conspiracy of a hoax in order for it to be untrue.
Blue Orange
Gone to Texas
1. Is it possible he was making fun of his dad? Writing a whole book as a joke might seem unlikely, but this was a guy who as we know was a huge fan of the 'false documents' technique (it's all through Tekumel). Doesn't seem out of character.
2. This was in 1991. Is there any reason to assume he maintained Neo-Nazi beliefs for the next 20 years? (He died in 2012.) Did he ever advocate for them in any fashion over the next 30 years? Are we going to judge a person by every dumb thing they've ever done? He made one of the first RPGs to use non-European inspirations, which is somewhat odd for a white supremacist to do, particularly in the late 20th century. While I am aware of the Nazi occultist current and attempts at synthesizing Islamic and Nazi philosophy (not to mention Hindu-Nazi authors like Savitri Devi), the one thing I seem to get from reading his life is that he was an extreme xenophile (and maybe this was a rebellion against Dad).
3. Again, this was in 1991. White nationalism was much weaker then than it is now, and he might not have felt as bad (assuming in fact he was not a Nazi) about writing a fake white nationalist book if it wasn't going to convert anyone. A vaccine conspiracy plot is different in 2000 (remember the X-files smallpox vaccination subplot?) than in 2020.
4. Yet again...1991. There was much more of an acceptance of 'edgy' humor back then, and it might have been something along the lines of 'let me write this totally crazy thing to make fun of my dad'. (I think my attitudes are probably closer to 1991 than 2022 TBH).
I am half Jewish by ancestry (and lost a few extended family members to the Nazis), but am not inclined to 'cancel' Barker over an obscure book he wrote in 1991. Indeed, I think I will go and donate a little to the Tekumel Foundation. We used to make stuff like The Producers, now we're digging up 30-year-old dirt on game designers who have been dead for a decade.
Now if you want to talk about Louis-Ferdinand Celine...
2. This was in 1991. Is there any reason to assume he maintained Neo-Nazi beliefs for the next 20 years? (He died in 2012.) Did he ever advocate for them in any fashion over the next 30 years? Are we going to judge a person by every dumb thing they've ever done? He made one of the first RPGs to use non-European inspirations, which is somewhat odd for a white supremacist to do, particularly in the late 20th century. While I am aware of the Nazi occultist current and attempts at synthesizing Islamic and Nazi philosophy (not to mention Hindu-Nazi authors like Savitri Devi), the one thing I seem to get from reading his life is that he was an extreme xenophile (and maybe this was a rebellion against Dad).
3. Again, this was in 1991. White nationalism was much weaker then than it is now, and he might not have felt as bad (assuming in fact he was not a Nazi) about writing a fake white nationalist book if it wasn't going to convert anyone. A vaccine conspiracy plot is different in 2000 (remember the X-files smallpox vaccination subplot?) than in 2020.
4. Yet again...1991. There was much more of an acceptance of 'edgy' humor back then, and it might have been something along the lines of 'let me write this totally crazy thing to make fun of my dad'. (I think my attitudes are probably closer to 1991 than 2022 TBH).
I am half Jewish by ancestry (and lost a few extended family members to the Nazis), but am not inclined to 'cancel' Barker over an obscure book he wrote in 1991. Indeed, I think I will go and donate a little to the Tekumel Foundation. We used to make stuff like The Producers, now we're digging up 30-year-old dirt on game designers who have been dead for a decade.
Now if you want to talk about Louis-Ferdinand Celine...
Last edited:
darjr
I crit!
Rpg.net thread
🚦 A-Game - M.A.R. Barker, creator of Tékumel, wrote a neo-Nazi novel in 1991 (He also sat on the board of a Holocaust-denial publication) | Tabletop Roleplaying Open
Since this is all being hashed out again, I strongly suggest that everyone read the full posts by Chirine linked above, not only the excerpts. The matter is better explained by people who knew and worked with the Professor for decades, rather than amateur sleuths and philosophers on Reddit...
forum.rpg.net
This last bit I know nothing else about.
eyeheartawk
#1 Enworld Jerk™
That's, as the kids would say, a big oof.
