Dragonlance Dragonlance Adventure & Prelude Details Revealed

Over on DND Beyond Amy Dallen and Eugenio Vargas discuss the beginning of Shadow of ther Dragon Queen and provide some advice on running it.

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This epic war story begins with an invitation to a friend's funeral and three optional prelude encounters that guide you into the world of Krynn. Amy Dallen is joined by Eugenio Vargas to share some details about how these opening preludes work and some advice on using them in your own D&D games.


There is also information on the three short 'prelude' adventures which introduce players to the world of Krynn:
  • Eye in the Sky -- ideal for sorcerers, warlocks, wizards, or others seeking to become members of the Mages of High Sorcery.
  • Broken Silence -- ideal for clerics, druids, paladins, and other characters with god-given powers.
  • Scales of War -- ideal for any character and reveals the mysterious draconians.
The article discusses Session Zero for the campaign and outlines what to expect in a Dragonlance game -- war, death, refugees, and so on.

 

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But for anyone familiar with the story of the Flood, the story should be comprehensible.

Attacking it as a tale about genocide is just a bizarre misreading.
When I explained the setting to my table who had no prior knowledge of the setting, I described a fiery mountain falling from the sky obliterating the religious center of the world with the gods withdrawing their influence from the world in the aftermath. The first comment a player made?

"Sounds intense, are we talking something like a biblical flood or something like that?"

Even without providing any info on the gods' involvement or the Kingpriest's motives, he arrived at that conclusion.
 

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OK, so you want us to, in the face of the clear connections, clear influence, and clear parallels, just ignore those and...then judge it without the relevance, nuance, history and context?

I think not, as it robs the work of...well quite a bit of what makes it what it is.
Yes. It's the same sort of nonsense that caused people to think "D&D has monsters that are named after real demons; therefore, D&D is evil and demonic."

Says the individual struggling to separate fantasy sensibilities from modern sensibilities. :unsure:
The game was written in modern times, to be played by modern people, and therefore uses modern sensibilities.

Dragonlance is not (just) a novel. It's not frozen in time and place. It's something that continues to grow and change as new editions are produced and new players make their mark on the world.

Also? As I said before, it's unrealistic to take a fantasy world with fantasy elements and assume it would have the exact same sensibilities and progression of history as the real world does.
 

Yes. It's the same sort of nonsense that caused people to think "D&D has monsters that are named after real demons; therefore, D&D is evil and demonic."

And its nonsense to say D&D is evil and demonic, but...do the Hells reference things which are particularly going to resonate within a Christian population?

As I said before, it's unrealistic to take a fantasy world with fantasy elements and assume it would have the exact same sensibilities and progression of history as the real world does.

Its all unrealistic, its Fantasy.

I'm not making any assumption here, I'm following a clear as day progression that has been stated a number of times.

You dont like the concept, that doesnt mean it isnt being used. The Cataclysm, is the Flood.
 

You dont like the concept, that doesnt mean it isnt being used. The Cataclysm, is the Flood.
I do wonder if any OTHER creator gets a pass based on their religion? Taking the flood story as just a story (not a holy scripture) makes that author look bad too.

If we can’t separate the faith of a real world religion from the game then does that mean ANY real world religion is okay to be used?
 

To me it's more simple than this.

First, DL is no different from JRRT's work, with has a more-or-less identical cataclysmic event in the Downfall of Numenor. But none of these critics of DL are out there attacking The One Ring, Adventures in Middle Earth, etc, or saying that people who enjoy the LotR films are endorsing genocide. There's a fixation on DL that (to me) is quite unexplained.
Very easily explainable.

One: Why would you assume that people who have read or played in Dragonlance are LotR fans? I'm certainly not. And all that stuff was, as far as I can tell, from The Silmarillion and not from LotR or the Hobbit. So why would people who are not die-hard fans know or even care about it?

Two: As far as I can tell, Eru Ilúvatar is not statted out to be Lawful Good for a system that has rules about what that entails and what happens if you act against that alignment. Nor does D&D say that gods are exempt from these alignment rules or that genocide should be considered acceptable if it performed by a god.

Three: I at no point ever said or implied that you or anyone else were endorsing genocide. I didn't even say Weiss and Hickman were endorsing genocide. What I said is that the "Gods of Good" in Dragonlance performed a massively evil act by committing genocide and shouldn't be considered to be good-aligned. If you're taking this that personally, maybe you should just put me on ignore.

Edit: Four: This thread is on Dragonlance, not LotR.

Second, DL is a work of fiction (as is JRRT's work). It doesn't depend for it's narrative power on believing that there was an actual Flood decreed by an actual God. It depends, rather, on the reader being familiar with that story as a cultural artefact. Someone can be an atheist and yet understand a story that uses the tropes of the Flood to present the question of the relationship of human action, and political power, to self-destructive and self-defeating hubris. Not everyone will find the story compelling - they might think it's silly, or think that concerns about power and hubris are essentially obscurantist (eg a certain sort of Marxist might think that). But for anyone familiar with the story of the Flood, the story should be comprehensible.

Attacking it as a tale about genocide is just a bizarre misreading.
One: Nobody has said it's a tale about genocide. It's a tale that involves genocide that's being treated as an acceptable thing.

Two: We all realize that it uses the tropes of the biblical flood. I, for one, am trying to respect this forum's rules on not talking about real-world religion by keeping my discussion to only the game. You're the one that keeps bringing up real-world religions.

Two-Point-One: IMO, if you have to say "this thing makes total sense if you use this other thing as context," when that other thing isn't even part of the source material, then the first thing still can be judged without that context.

Two-Point-Two: Just because something makes total sense if you use the other thing as context, it doesn't mean the first thing is exempt from criticism.

Three: Yes, it is a work of fiction. This is what I've been saying for pages now. If you can't separate the game from the real-world religion, then that must mean that you think Dragonlance shouldn't be discussed at all on these boards. If you can separate the two, then you should have no problem addressing the genocide as it's own thing and not in how it was used in Abrahamic religion.
 
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I do wonder if any OTHER creator gets a pass based on their religion? Taking the flood story as just a story (not a holy scripture) makes that author look bad too.

If we can’t separate the faith of a real world religion from the game then does that mean ANY real world religion is okay to be used?

I'm not making a value judgment here.

I'm certainly not going to judge others for their culture or religion.

I'm simply offering why I can understand the perspective of

1. The kingpriest.
2. The cataclysm.
3 The gods still being 'good' with the context intact.
 

I do wonder if any OTHER creator gets a pass based on their religion? Taking the flood story as just a story (not a holy scripture) makes that author look bad too.

If we can’t separate the faith of a real world religion from the game then does that mean ANY real world religion is okay to be used?
I think you are missing the larger point here.

It isn't that "The Cataclysm is the Flood in the Old Testament; therefore, it's bad".

Instead, it's "The Cataclysm was a planet altering event which killed millions of people -- most of them innocent; therefore, that act was Evil".

The fact that is has a real-world religious parallel in the Old Testament may inform the player about the choices the author made - and perhaps why he made them.

But whether you get into the weeds concerning that or not, it doesn't really impact on the immorality of the Cataclysm itself as depicted in the novels and setting.
 

And its nonsense to say D&D is evil and demonic, but...do the Hells reference things which are particularly going to resonate within a Christian population?
And that would mean that they didn't actually understand D&D because they didn't realize that it was a fantasy game that should be judged on its own merit. Did AD&D use the names of "real" demons? Yes. Was it actually a book on devil worship? No. Just like how Dragonlance is a fantasy game. Was Dragonlance partially inspired by Mormonism? Yes. Is it actually a religious text? No.

Its all unrealistic, its Fantasy.
Then you should have no problem with people criticizing it and saying it's wrong.

I'm not making any assumption here, I'm following a clear as day progression that has been stated a number of times.

You dont like the concept, that doesnt mean it isnt being used. The Cataclysm, is the Flood.
The Cataclysm is not the Flood. Inspired by, yes. Is, no.

And I never said that it wasn't being used. I have no idea where that came from.
 

I'm not making a value judgment here.

I'm certainly not going to judge others for their culture or religion.

I'm simply offering why I can understand the perspective of

1. The kingpriest.
2. The cataclysm.
3 The gods still being 'good' with the context intact.
So when someone of different Religious beliefs is in charge of the setting does that change? (Do we know the affiliation of all writers?)
 

I think you are missing the larger point here.

It isn't that "The Cataclysm is the Flood in the Old Testament; therefore, it's bad".

Instead, it's "The Cataclysm was a planet altering event which killed millions of people -- most of them innocent; therefore, that act was Evil".
I understand that. If you look at past threads I even agree with it but had taken a break from enworld hopeing this would be passed by the time the books started leaking.
The fact that is has a real-world religious parallel in the Old Testament may inform the player about the choices the author made - and perhaps why he made them.
Why? Should I study the religion of all game creators before I read their setting?
But whether you get into the weeds concerning that or not, it doesn't really impact on the immorality of the Cataclysm itself as depicted in the novels and setting.
And again. I agree it was an evil act and gods that are on the hood alignment should at least be ashamed and regreatful for it
 

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