Hello, I am lawyer with a PSA: almost everyone is wrong about the OGL and SRD. Clearing up confusion.

Jerik

Explorer
Looking at d20srd.org, it is somewhat careless with its legalities (for one thing, they still have the d20 System logo up and I'm pretty sure that license has been withdrawn since at least 2008). A better site to use is probably dndsrd.net, which among other things includes this on its "Legal" page:

Except that dndsrd.net also still has the d20 System logo up, right there in the upper left corner of the page. And also claims in the text of the home page to still be using it "according to the terms of the [long discontinued] d20 System License version 5.0." And d20srd.org also includes the Open Game License, and goes into a lot more detail about permissions and legalities on its Terms of Use page than dndsrd.net does on its Legal page.

Not sure why you're seeing one site as a better example than the other. If it's careless misuse of the d20 System License, they both seem equally guilty of that. (Heck, both sites use the d20 System logo as their favicon!)
 

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Steel_Wind

Legend
OK, I read that post. It seems consistent with my posts just above. @Steel_Wind is not using "de-authorization" as a term of art, as best I read his post. And he doesn't actually set out an argument as to how WotC might achieve what it wants to achieve - he just states the result.

The interpretive argument I've set out is the best one I know of that actually produces, in a legally reasoned manner, the result that WotC appears to be aspiring to.

(Of course I haven't considered the extent to which matters that sit outside the licence - like the FAQ and other conduct by WotC and its officers - might bear upon the interpretive questions. That's part of why I do not suggest that my argument is sound, or even likely - just that it seems to me not hopeless.)
There appears to be a difference between what I understand how the "de-authorization" argument works, and how others conceive of it. The confusion (in some quarters) arises through a muddle of unclear thinking - and a confusion between forms of an offer yet to be accepted, and the form of an executed license agreement which has been accepted and is currently in place. They look like the same thing -- but they aren't.

Firstly, there is a difference between the FORM of the OGL 1.0a license, on the one hand referring to the form and content of a text document that amounts to an offer -- and the FORM of an executed license contract, being an offer which was accepted and complied with, with consideration moving between the parties and is in place. They appear to be identical, but one of them is an offer and is mutable -- indeed -- wholly revocable at will by WotC, while the other, after acceptance, is a contract that can no longer be changed other than in accordance with its terms (and even then). The ability of WotC to "update the license" is not the same thing as WotC being able to "update an executed contract". Those are not the same things, at all.

Under the principles of contract formation, WotC can choose to unilaterally alter the form of any offer it makes; that means that WotC can choose arbitrarily and when it sees fit to alter the form of any OGL offer it will make in the future. Nobody is seriously suggesting that they can't do that, generally speaking.

Just because a party made an offer in a particular form last week, last month or last year, does not normally bind them to do so next week, next month or next year, unless there is some other basis to contractually hold them to that promise.

I do not doubt that WotC can unilaterally withdraw its offer to enter into further fresh OGL 1.0a agreements in the future; they can unilaterally withdraw that offer. However, that same unilateral power is about changes to offers, it says nothing about changes to an OGL 1.0a agreement to which it is already a party and which is underway.

There is no power under the OGL 1.0a for WotC to announce it is changing or altering the terms of an existing license contract. So if a 3pp has complied with the OGL 1.0a license terms and printed 5,000 books, shipped 4,000 out of its warehouse and sold them to a distributor, there is nothing that WotC can do under that license to alter the validity of those lawful acts under the license agreement. That bullet has left the chamber. There is no power to revoke, by way of de-authorization or otherwise, in my view.

So, in the case of 5,000 books printed, 4,000 shipped out, and 1,000 sitting in the warehouse still:

1- the OGL 1.0a is not capable of retroactive amendment so as to disentitle the distributor to distribute or the retailer to sell the 4.000 books in the system;

2- In my view, the same result applies to the 1,000 books still in the 3pp publisher's warehouse, the grant of the rights under the OGL 1.0a is noted in s.4 of the license: "4. Grant and Consideration: In consideration for agreeing to use this License, the Contributors grant You a perpetual, worldwide, royalty-free, nonexclusive license with the exact terms of this License to Use, the Open Game Content." There is no restriction or gloss on use and s. 9 doesn't enter into it.

3- The uncertainty looking forward is how does this apply in three specific future instances:

a- how does it apply to new copies of the same book I have already released under the OGL 1.0a license?

b - how does it apply to derivative works I or another might make use of the previously released licensed work in the future?

c- how does it apply to a completely new work somebody else might make in the future? (See above - entirely new offer and WotC can do whatever it wants here)

a - I take the position that on a reasonable construction of the license contract, the license, once exercised, is perpetual and as it is for consideration, it's not revocable. I get to make new copies of that same book next week, next month, and next year. That use is not using a new license, rather, it's simply making new copies of the same book I already have under an existing license with a term that does not expire. Perpetual has that meaning. (I think a court is very likely to agree with this interpretation, btw.)

b - derivative works: this is the difficult part. On the text of the license itself, without going to parol evidence concerning what the parties understood and represented the agreement to mean, any subsequent use of the material in a derivative work could be pursuant to a mix of using a new license and in relying upon an old one, and here s. 9 comes into play, so pay attention.

WotC can amend the form of the OGL, there is no ambiguity about that -- they absolutely can. The only question is, under the wording of s. 9 of the license, can they amend the OGL license in a way which prevents a derivative work from being unable to rely upon the OGL 1.0a, and instead, be restricted to the terms of using only the newly amended license terms?

This is the contractual source of the "de-authorization" argument: "9. Updating the License: Wizards or its designated Agents may publish updated versions of this License. You may use any authorized version of this License to copy, modify and distribute any Open Game Content originally distributed under any version of this License."

You will note that this only applies in the event that a work has been previously distributed under a version of the OGL. We don't worry about this section in terms of a work that has not been previously distributed. In that event, we are back to the "Contract First Principles" that WotC can unilaterally change the terms of its offer at any time. But with derivative work, we are talking about stuff already out there in the wild under the OGL 1.0a.

There are two possibilities:
1 - WotC amends the form of the OGL 1.0a, to OGL 1.5, say. And a subsequent use of that previously distributed game content under the OGL 1.0a is now subject to OGL 1.5, not 1.0a; OR.
2- WotC amends the form of the OGL 1.0a, to OGL 1.5, the new publisher elects to ignore 1.5 and instead elects to continue to use the OGL 1.0a in accordance with s. 9 of the OGL 1.0a.

On a plain reading of s.9, scenario #2 is what is supposed to occur.

WotC now says that they have amended the OGL to 1.5, and that they no longer authorize the use of 1.0a.

WotC can absolutely say this going forward for new content - because that ability doesn't arise under a contract, it arises under the power of any party to change or amend the form and terms of an offer to contract (not the same thing).

But WotC can't do this in respect of content that was previously distributed under the OGL 1.0a license, because that distribution is now subject to the terms of an existing contract. You don't get to arbitrarily change the rules after that race has started to run. That content gets to be used -- and re-used -- under the OGL 1.0a, as that is an authorized form of the license and the initial publisher was (and currently is, and will be in the future) entitled to rely on it -- at least for republication purposes -- and the new publisher is too.

But for new publication purposes of new content? No. We are back at WotC getting to change the terms of the offer going forward as they may prefer.

There is no express mention of, or even a necessary or implicit interpretation within s. 9, that WotC can "de-authorize" a form of the OGL and so prevent it from being used to publish previously published content. If the form of license was authorized, the licensee explicitly gets to pick and choose from which previous authorized form(s) it prefers to use in distributing previously released content. That a licensee is explicitly empowered to pick and choose which authorized form it wants, and the same section is interpreted to wholly take away the benefit of that election - that would be a perversion of the plain meaning of the section, imo.

Not only is there no power to "de-authorize" mentioned, but the necessary implication of s.9 as written is that multiple forms of an OGL may have been authorized in the past, and the publisher gets to pick and choose from any of them to use to publish previously distributed content, as they may prefer. There is no power to de-authorize, the only power is to update the form of the OGL, going forward. No only is there no power to de-authorize, but the most reasonable interpretation of s. 9 is that de-authorization is implicitly (if not explicitly) forbidden.

Just so long as you understand that the entitlement to continue to rely upon 1.0a applies ONLY to distributing previously released material. It doesn't govern a license for wholly new material - and it arguably doesn't govern the release of derivative material either. On the derivative works issue, that may be subject to a new form of OGL license that WotC might choose to update and restrain or curtail... or maybe not, too. (Here, there is parol evidence to inform the court as to what the parties intended and understood the contract to mean concerning this use).

Practically speaking, it means it is going to be very hard for WotC to escape the ongoing use of the 5.1 SRD which was released under the OGL 1.0a. They don't get to make that vanish or prevent it from being distributed under the OGL 1.0a in the future. Where it gets difficult is with derivative material. When it comes to new material, that is where WotC has freedom and room to change the ground rules, not under the terms of an existing OGL license contract, but as a person who has the freedom to contract -- and not contract -- on the basis of any offer it chooses to make in the future.

As for rushing about and trying to "get under the wire" and make use of 1.0a while they still can, I put it to you that this is one of the motivating factors which is behind Kobold Press' moving forward with Project Black Flag in a manner which seems to be motivated with great haste. I think that's why they are doing what they are doing as the protection for someone who is already under the the OGL 1.0a is present, and it simply isn't at all for those who have not yet published.
 
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Enrahim2

Adventurer
2- In my view, the same result applies to the 1,000 books still in the 3pp publisher's warehouse, the grant of the rights under the OGL 1.0a is noted in s.4 of the license: "4. Grant and Consideration: In consideration for agreeing to use this License, the Contributors grant You a perpetual, worldwide, royalty-free, nonexclusive license with the exact terms of this License to Use, the Open Game Content." There is no restriction or gloss on use and s. 9 doesn't enter into it.
Great breakdown!

There is one thing that still puzzles me with this argument though. Let us say that A offers a license to B having the form of 1.0a. If B accepts, we have an existing licence contract between A and B having the 1.0a. From my understanding part of the contract is that B has to offer a sub licence to any derivative work, and that offer has to be of the 1.0a form.

Now there are two licence offers: One from A and one from B. We also have an existing contract. You seem to argue that A can always retract their licence offer, which I think is a sound argument. Further you argue that the existing contract will survive, that appear to be the general agreement likely is the case. If I understand you correctly what you are further investigating is the rights provided under this existing contract.

What I am however miss is a mention of what happen with the offer from B? While it seem reasonable that A can retract their offer, it is not clear to me how they can retract or modify the offer from B? For instance it seem like B has the right to extend the licence offer, as all the material that isnt their is licenced under an active existing licence that is explicitely alows for (sub)licensing of the licenced material (ref 1(c) Distribute used in 1(g) Use).

From my understanding it is this offer from B that is the main veichle that could allow production of further new derivative works. And moreover it is my understanding that the grant described i section 4 of the offer presented by B would be sufficient for a party C to publish such new derivative work as long as they accept B's offer. As such I fail to see how section 9 would be relevant at all, as long as C is happy with a licence "with the exact terms of this License"?

But maybe this is where I misread. I have taken the "with the exact terms of this license" to mean that in order to get the rights under that grant, you have to comply with the terms of the FORM of the offered licence (in this case 1.0a), contrasted to the more general grant offered for use under any authorised OGL in section 9. Is there a different understanding of the phrase "with the exact terms of this license", that mean section 9 is needed for C to make use of the offer from B? In that case I can understand why it might not be needed to say more about the offer from B.
 

Just so long as you understand that the entitlement to continue to rely upon 1.0a applies ONLY to distributing previously released material. It doesn't govern a license for wholly new material - and it probably doesn't govern the release of derivative material either. That is subject to a new form of OGL license that WotC might choose to update and restrain or curtail.
I found this to be a super-helpful post. Could you please define "derivative material" in this context? I'm trying to get a handle on what would count as "new" and what would count as "derivative."
 

tomBitonti

Adventurer
There appears to be a difference between what I understand how the "de-authorization" argument works, and how others conceive of it. The confusion (in some quarters) arises through a muddle of unclear thinking - and a confusion between forms of an offer yet to be accepted, and the form of an executed license agreement which has been accepted and is currently in place. They look like the same thing -- but they aren't.

Firstly, there is a difference between the FORM of the OGL 1.0a license, on the one hand referring to the form and content of a text document that amounts to an offer -- and the FORM of an executed license contract, being an offer which was accepted and complied with, with consideration moving between the parties and is in place. They appear to be identical, but one of them is an offer and is mutable -- indeed -- wholly revocable at will by WotC, while the other, after acceptance, is a contract that can no longer be changed other than in accordance with its terms (and even then). The ability of WotC to "update the license" is not the same thing as WotC being able to "update an executed contract". Those are not the same things, at all.

Under the principles of contract formation, WotC can choose to unilaterally alter for the form of any offer it makes; that means that WotC can choose arbitrarily and when it sees fit to alter the form of any OGL offer it will make in the future. Nobody is seriously suggesting that they can't do that, generally speaking.

Just because a party made an offer in a particular form last week, last month or last year, does not normally bind them to do so next week, next month or next year, unless there is some other basis to contractually hold them to that promise.

I do not doubt that WotC can unilaterally withdraw its offer to enter into further fresh OGL 1.0a agreements in the future; they can unilaterally withdraw that offer. However, that same unilateral power is about changes to offers, it says nothing about changes to an OGL 1.0a agreement to which it is already a party and which is underway.

There is no power under the OGL 1.0a for WotC to announce it is changing or altering the terms of an existing license contract. So if a 3pp has complied with the OGL 1.0a license terms and printed 5,000 books, shipped 4,000 out of its warehouse and sold them to a distributor, there is nothing that WotC can do under that license to alter the validity of those lawful acts under the license agreement. That bullet has left the chamber. There is no power to revoke, by way of de-authorization or otherwise, in my view.

So, in the case of 5,000 books printed, 4,000 shipped out, and 1,000 sitting in the warehouse still:

1- the OGL 1.0a is not capable of retroactive amendment so as to disentitle the distributor to distribute or the retailer to sell the 4.000 books in the system;

2- In my view, the same result applies to the 1,000 books still in the 3pp publisher's warehouse, the grant of the rights under the OGL 1.0a is noted in s.4 of the license: "4. Grant and Consideration: In consideration for agreeing to use this License, the Contributors grant You a perpetual, worldwide, royalty-free, nonexclusive license with the exact terms of this License to Use, the Open Game Content." There is no restriction or gloss on use and s. 9 doesn't enter into it.

3- The uncertainty looking forward is how does this apply in three specific future instances:

a- how does it apply to new copies of the same book I have already released under the OGL 1.0a license?

b - how does it apply to derivative works I or another might make use of the previously released licensed work in the future?

c- how does it apply to a completely new work somebody else might make in the future? (See above - entirely new offer and WotC can do whatever it wants here)

a - I take the position that on a reasonable construction of the license contract, the license, once exercised, is perpetual and as it is for consideration, it's not revocable. I get to make new copies of that same book next week, next month, and next year. That use is not using a new license, rather, it's simply making new copies of the same book I already have under an existing license with a term that does not expire. Perpetual has that meaning. (I think a court is very likely to agree with this interpretation, btw.)

b - derivative works: this is the difficult part. On the text of the license itself, without going to parol evidence concerning what the parties understood and represented the agreement to mean, any subsequent use of the material in a derivative work would be pursuant to using a new license, and here s. 9 comes into play, so pay attention.

WotC can amend the form of the OGL, there is no ambiguity about that -- they absolutely can. The only question is, under the wording of s. 9 of the license, can they amend the OGL license in a way which prevents a derivative work from being unable to rely upon the OGL 1.0a, and instead, be restricted to the terms of using only the newly amended license terms?

This is the contractual source of the "de-authorization" argument: "9. Updating the License: Wizards or its designated Agents may publish updated versions of this License. You may use any authorized version of this License to copy, modify and distribute any Open Game Content originally distributed under any version of this License."

You will note that this only applies in the event that a work has been previously distributed under a version of the OGL. We don't worry about this section in terms of a work that has not been previously distributed. In that event, we are back to the "Contract First Principles" that WotC can unilaterally change the terms of its offer at any time. But now we are talking about stuff already out there in the wild under the OGL 1.0a.

There are two possibilities:
1 - WotC amends the form of the OGL 1.0a, to OGL 1.5, say. And a subsequent use of that previously distributed game content under the OGL 1.0a is now subject to OGL 1.5, not 1.0a; OR.
2- WotC amends the form of the OGL 1.0a, to OGL 1.5, the new publisher elects to ignore 1.5 and instead elects to continue to use the OGL 1.0a in accordance with s. 9 of the OGL 1.0a.

On a plain reading of s.9, scenario #2 is what is supposed to occur.

WotC now says that they have amended the OGL to 1.5, and that they no longer authorize the use of 1.0a.

WotC can absolutely say this going forward for new content - because that ability doesn't arise under a contract, it arises under the power of any party to change or amend the form and terms of an offer to contract (not the same thing).

But WotC can't do this in respect of content that was previously distributed under the OGL 1.0a license, because that distribution is now subject to the terms of an existing contract. You don't get to arbitrarily change the rules after that race has started to run. That content gets to be used -- and re-used -- under the OGL 1.0a, as that is an authorized form of the license and the initial publisher was (and currently is, and will be in the future) entitled to rely on it -- at least for republication purposes -- and the new publisher is too.

But for new publication purposes of new content? No. We are back at WotC getting to change the terms of the offer going forward as they may prefer.

There is no express mention of, or even a necessary or implicit interpretation within s. 9, that WotC can "de-authorize" a form of the OGL and so prevent it from being used to publish previously published content. If the form of license was authorized, the licensee explicitly gets to pick and choose from which previous authorized forms it prefers to use in distributing previously released content. That a licensee is explicitly empowered to pick and choose which authorized form it wants, and the same section is interpreted to take away the benefit of that electionm would be a perversion of the plain meaning of the section.

Not only is there no power to "de-authorize" mentioned, but the necessary implication of s.9 as written is that multiple forms of an OGL may have been authorized in the past, and the publisher gets to pick and choose from any of them to use to publish previously distributed content, as they may prefer. There is no power to de-authorize, the only power is to update the form of the OGL, going forward. No only is there no power to de-authorize, but the most reasonable interpretation of s. 9 is that de-authorization is implicitly (if not explicitly) forbidden.

Just so long as you understand that the entitlement to continue to rely upon 1.0a applies ONLY to distributing previously released material. It doesn't govern a license for wholly new material - and it probably doesn't govern the release of derivative material either. That is subject to a new form of OGL license that WotC might choose to update and restrain or curtail.

Practically speaking, it means it is going to be very hard for WotC to escape the ongoing use of the 5.1 SRD which was released under the OGL 1.0a. They don't get to make that vanish or prevent it from being distributed under the OGL 1.0a in the future. Where it gets difficult is with entirely new or derivative material. That is where WotC has freedom and room to change the ground rules, not under the terms of an existing OGL license contract, but as a person who has the freedom to contract -- and not contract -- on the basis of any offer it chooses to make in the future.

The text:
You may use any authorized version of this License to copy, modify and distribute any Open Game Content originally distributed under any version of this License.
.

Isn't “use” a privilege granted by the license? Then, so long as “authorized” is still in effect, ”You may use” seems unrestricted. What prevents it from applying to new products?

This seems to be permission to use any OGC — as a benefit granted by the license. That permission being granted by all contributors, since they all agreed to license their originated OGC by agreeing to the license.

As long as at least one license exists, either from WotC or granted by a different Contributor, since the other Contributor licenses are identical to that orinally offered by WotC, doesn’t that also allow new licenses?

TomB
 

pemerton

Legend
Just so long as you understand that the entitlement to continue to rely upon 1.0a applies ONLY to distributing previously released material. It doesn't govern a license for wholly new material - and it probably doesn't govern the release of derivative material either. That is subject to a new form of OGL license that WotC might choose to update and restrain or curtail.
Everything in your post seems right to me, except I was unsure about what I've bolded: section 9 on its face appears to allow the licensee to pick and choose among licences (not subject to WotC's control) when they modify currently licensed OGC. So I'm not clear which derivative material you have in mind. (EDIT: I think this is the same question as @Greg Benage's.)

My view is that WotC relying on section 9 to get what they want is a weak argument. Again with the caveat that it is a purely textual argument, I think my argument that rests on sections 2, 3 and 4 (and their uses of the words "the" and "any") is stronger. Which is not to say I think my argument is the best interpretation available.
 
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pemerton

Legend
Because of section 8 WOTC had to clearly identify the OGC from SRD 5.1.
They've done that. I'm the only person to have quoted where they do that in this thread, I believe.

When you publish a short pamphlet under the OGL, setting out the stats for the Gladiator found on p 394 of this SRD <https://media.wizards.com/2016/downloads/SRD-OGL_V1.1.pdf> plus your own stats for a gish Gladiator, what OGC of WotC's are you now licensed to use? Just the Gladiator statblock you reproduced? Or all the OGC in the SRD?

Clearly the same.
What makes it clear? Why does section 2 refer to "any" OGC?

Not sure I see any relevance but I agree.
Identifying what content is licensed is pretty fundamental to understanding the legal effect and operation of a contractual licence.

The scope of the license and that clause is more local.
I don't know what this means.

The scope of the license and that clause is more local. The specific implementation mandates you include the contributors copyrights. If it’s as you say then you would need to constantly update your list. But you do not.
This makes no sense. The copyright statement for the two alternatives I've suggested is the same.
 
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pemerton

Legend
From my understanding it is this offer from B that is the main veichle that could allow production of further new derivative works. And moreover it is my understanding that the grant described i section 4 of the offer presented by B would be sufficient for a party C to publish such new derivative work as long as they accept B's offer
I don't know what @Steel_Wind's reply is.

I think what you say here is a plausible view. For the reasons given in my recent posts (eg 2140) I don't think it is certain.
 

Steel_Wind

Legend
Everything in your post seems right to me, except I was unsure about what I've bolded: section 9 on its face appears to allow the licensee to pick and choose among licences (not subject to WotC's control) when they modify currently licensed OGC. So I'm not clear which derivative material you have in mind. (EDIT: I think this is the same question as @Greg Benage's.)

My view is that WotC relying on section 9 to get what they want is a weak argument. Again with the caveat that it is a purely textual argument, I think my argument that rests on sections 2, 3 and 4 (and their uses of the words "the" and "any") is stronger. Which is not to say I think my argument is the best interpretation available.
I edited that -- you'll note that I have changed it from what you have quoted (for the good reaosn that it is wrong!) I was fighting my computer to log back on to change that for 90 minutes!

But I have now. It now reads:

"It doesn't govern a license for wholly new material - and it arguably doesn't govern the release of derivative material either. On the derivative works issue, that may be subject to a new form of OGL license that WotC might choose to update and restrain or curtail... or maybe not, too. (Here, there is parol evidence to inform the court as to what the parties intended and understood the contract to mean concerning this use)."

And that brings us back to what the parties said and didn't say, did and didn't do, and the acts taken (and not taken) -- especially back in 2008 in relation to PF1 = all with a view to helping the court resolve the contractual ambiguity. We've been down that road already.
 

Steel_Wind

Legend
The text:
.

Isn't “use” a privilege granted by the license? Then, so long as “authorized” is still in effect, ”You may use” seems unrestricted. What prevents it from applying to new products?

This seems to be permission to use any OGC — as a benefit granted by the license. That permission being granted by all contributors, since they all agreed to license their originated OGC by agreeing to the license.

As long as at least one license exists, either from WotC or granted by a different Contributor, since the other Contributor licenses are identical to that orinally offered by WotC, doesn’t that also allow new licenses?

TomB
On the "authorized" topic, the idea and intention in s.9 according to what Dancey has said is that was simply saying that in the event WotC makes a change in the license later (updates it) the publisher can use any version it prefers of a previously approved OGL license -- but it has to be text that had been authorized by WotC. You don't get to quote a version of the license that appears in a product that includes text that WotC didn't authorize, and then rely on that misprint.

The fact that WotC previously authorized it is what s.9 is focusing on. De-authorization doesn't enter into it. It would be rare indeed that WotC would "update" the license going forward and not end the prior versions of the license going forward, too. But in the case of dealing with material previously released, the licensee gets to pick and choose from multiple versions which were authorized at some point, (regardless of whether they are current now) and rely on it.

Seen through this prism, de-authorization is a weak argument. It looks the same (but isn't the same) as WotC stating its how things are going to be going forward under a new license for new material. WotC can do that for new material - that is beyond doubt, imo.

De-authorization is not a revocation, either. Those terms can mean different things (and in this case, they do).
 

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