Unpopular opinions go here

[Micah Sweet]

Sorry, I grew up in Central California, and I found it to be a hellhole in nearly every possible way. But different strokes!

Central Coast, if that makes any difference.

 

[Gradine]

Central Coast, if that makes any difference.

Oh, never mind! I thought you were talking about the Central Valley

 

[Cadence]

Why wouldn't the players be the ones to decide what's appropriate?

I'm imagining that the players have said they bought into some game the GM has offered to run, likely after some back and forth refining it. Say they agreed to a game where a party was going to go dungeon crawling. In that case one of them showing up with a loner druid who wouldn't go in enclosed spaces seems like a breach of some sort and inappropriate.

Edit: This example feels extreme to me. I've seen the agreeing to a dungeon crawl and making up a wilderness character and being upset that they weren't given enough places to shine, and also the agreeing to a typical adventuring party set-up and not particularly wanting to collaborate with the other players.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Sharp line no, but there is a line, and that line makes up the difference between a cohesive experience and an incoherent one.

Now, Roleplay is interactive, no doubt, but it isn't mechanical and fundamentally can't be when you get down to it (hence why social mechanics always tend to fail), and without mechanics, you're not actually creating a game.

Sharp or fuzzy line, if you can say "Roleplay" is a separate thing from playing a roleplaying game, that you must disengage from the game itself, in order to really roleplay, then I have to disagree. The playing of a roleplaying game is roleplaying. You do not need to pause the game and override it's resolution systems to roleplay. I mean, it may just be a bad game and avoiding it's resolution systems may be a good idea, but it's not necessary to do so in order to roleplay.
Rather, the line, there, between roleplaying by playing the game and disengaging from the game to roleplay without reference to rules or mechanics, is the line between TTRPG and Freestyle RP. Both are roleplaying, one is a game, the other is not, it's an exercise in improvisation or some such.

To me, a key litmus test for roleplaying is that you can assume a role that is different from yourself. In most RPGs, assuming a role that is taller, smaller, stronger, faster, tougher, more athletic, agile, deft, or even possesses supernatural power, is mechanically covered in robust ways, and blithely accepted in even the most radical corners of the hobby. While assuming a role of someone, more clever, cunning, knowledgeable, intelligent, persuasive, charismatic, diplomatic, or/and astute (or, less of any of those things) gets pretty fraught.

Mechanics can generate stories all on their own, without needing to force and hamfist the narrative.
So in that light, I would judge Story First/Story Now type stuff as being a fundamental misuse of the medium, which yet again loops back to my comments on innovation and how mechanics are being held back. Better mechanics will do more for a game to tell stories than trying to force it will.

And that sounds like a completely different sentiment than the above.

 

[Hussar]

Other countries seem to manage just fine in their social lubrication, sometimes even better, without the inane and insincere small talk people in the US seem find so necessary.

.

Really? Where? I live in Japan, which has raised the notion of insincere conversation to an art form. Korea as well. I’ve travelled pretty extensively in Asia actually and if anything, it’s even more pronounced than in the US.

 

[Scribe]

Really? Where? I live in Japan, which has raised the notion of insincere conversation to an art form. Korea as well. I’ve travelled pretty extensively in Asia actually and if anything, it’s even more pronounced than in the US.

I've worked with some Danish folks. Not to say they are rude, but even for IT folks they are incredibly blunt and direct. I dont know if that translates to their daily non-work life, but we were (on the project team) told that it would be like that, so there may be some level of truth to it.

 

[Gradine]

It's also worth pointing out that empty social niceties are largely a neurotypical thing. Neurodivergent folks are far more likely to not see the point and choose not to engage. There's a reason that neurodivergent people, especially those on the spectrum, are stereotyped as kind of blunt and rude.

 

[Emberashh]

Sharp or fuzzy line, if you can say "Roleplay" is a separate thing from playing a roleplaying game, that you must disengage from the game itself, in order to really roleplay, then I have to disagree.

Did I say you have to disengage from roleplay to engage with a game?

I think you're a little too focused on disputing what you think Im saying versus what I actually said.

If I put it another way, I could say that there's a reason telling me to just pretend to be a Ranger (when in the context of the game Im actually just a Fighter with a crummy feat) isn't satisfactory, particularly when Im already operating within a a pretend space.

Its the same reason why, in video game RPGs, it isn't satisfying to just pretend to be a Paladin when nothing in the game, mechanical or otherwise, actually cares about the choices you make to that end.

Rather, the line, there, between roleplaying by playing the game and disengaging from the game to roleplay without reference to rules or mechanics, is the line between TTRPG and Freestyle RP. Both are roleplaying, one is a game, the other is not, it's an exercise in improvisation or some such.

As said, you don't seem to be following what Im saying.

 

[overgeeked]

I've worked with some Danish folks. Not to say they are rude, but even for IT folks they are incredibly blunt and direct. I dont know if that translates to their daily non-work life, but we were (on the project team) told that it would be like that, so there may be some level of truth to it.

Yep. Germanic and Nordic countries seem to have successfully killed small talk. And they’re ranked as some of the happiest countries. I’m sure it’s more due to universal healthcare, lack of guns, and fractionally less insane politics than lack of small talk, but as someone who despises small talk, I’ll gladly say it’s part of the reason.

 

[Tony Vargas]

As said, you don't seem to be following what Im saying.

I suspected as much since the end of your post seemed to be saying the opposite of the beginning, to me, but I thought I'd try.... ....

Did I say you have to disengage from roleplay to engage with a game?

That's what I got out of this:

Now, Roleplay is interactive, no doubt, but it isn't mechanical and fundamentally can't be when you get down to it (hence why social mechanics always tend to fail), and without mechanics, you're not actually creating a game.

Sorry I misunderstood. What were you trying to say, there?