D&D 5E [+] Ways to fix the caster / non-caster gap

[Baron Opal II]

I've found merely allowing wizards to gain a single spell when they increase level, or simply matching spells known with spells castable as in B/X, mitigates the problem significantly. Allow all fighters to gain a damage bonus equal to half their level as well as cleave. And you're pretty much done.

Now, this does assume that fighters gain certain magic items that can address issues. Wings of flying, weapons that bypass damage resistance, and the like. I would rather it be abilities that could be learned, such as through subclasses or feats.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I've found merely allowing wizards to gain a single spell when they increase level, or simply matching spells known with spells castable as in B/X, mitigates the problem significantly. Allow all fighters to gain a damage bonus equal to half their level as well as cleave. And you're pretty much done.

Now, this does assume that fighters gain certain magic items that can address issues. Wings of flying, weapons that bypass damage resistance, and the like. I would rather it be abilities that could be learned, such as through subclasses or feats.

I for one never minded magic items being important, and felt making them otherwise was and continues to be a mistake in WotC 5e.

 

[tetrasodium]

People don't seem to have an issue with the BM and other fighters getting non-magical resources back on a short rest. There is already a caster that gets fireballs back on a short rest.

Maybe not Wish, but an ability replicating Foresight sounds like something a legendary martial could just have. Likewise deflecting or avoiding all damage for a period, executing someone below 100HP. Even Time Stop sounds like simply the next stage of Action Surge's evolution. A single blow that cuts clean through an object or a person sounds like a martial equivalent of Disintegrate. Blade Wind is already a spell that steals the Fighter's schtick, so the fighter getting a non-teleporting equivalent shouldn't be an issue.

While the usage mechanics might be different, many spells can be mined for concepts and to establish a power level for other abilities.

The trouble with giving fighter an "ability" like the ninth level spell foresight is that you are switching from a valuable spell slot the player wants to reserve and use until they have decided what the most effective use for it will be to a daily power that will be used everyday while we still continue to hear about "the caster / non-caster gap" we every time the caster chooses to use their ninth level spell slot on something else.

 

[Cadence]

Let non casters be heroic without needing magic. In a fantasy world where crazy stuff can happen, it makes sense that mundane skills can do fantastic things without people needing to justify it with, “oh, they must be magical in some way, or the son of a deity”. In a fantastic setting, not every skill needs to follow natural physical laws because, ina world of magical beasts, physics doesn’t always work the way people would expect.

One of the foundational changes to correct this is a mindset issue. Many players & DMs apply real-world simulation to parts that are not magic. "You can only long jump 20 feet*", for instance. With that * indicating "without magic". Casters and non-casters will never be equal in the various pillars of play as long as the people around both the gaming table and the design table mistakenly apply real world simulation as something that belongs anywhere near a game that should never be simulating the real world, instead should be simulating [heroic] fantasy tropes. A 30' giant can hit a barbarian with a literal perfect blow (crit, roll max damage) and the barbarian keeps fighting. That's not mimicing the real world. The tier 2 fighter can fall down 50' feel and always get back up and continue fighting. This is heroic or high fantasy.

This feels like a big one to me - what are the levels of ability in the campaign world that the usual people would think were outstandingly good, but not mystical. IRL olympic athlete? Hawkeye and Blackwidow? Blackpanther? Captain America? More than that?

The follow-up question I have for martial characters and physical feats is one I also have for wizards in terms of magic. How common is this among the non-adventurers? If the upper limits are Hawkeye/Black Widow, are those the kind of people that would be in that world's Olympics too?

 

[Pedantic]

I think the problem is fundamentally intractable in the current state, and comes down to picking which norm you want to violate. Either you're giving mundane characters a mechanic that will violate some player's definitional understanding of what mundane entails (usually limited use abilities, mind affecting abilities, or effects that ignore the "default" system) or you're making a change to casting that's too hard on the sacred cows, or equally bad, results in worse gameplay patterns without any real improvement.

I think a solution probably needs to be two-fold: rethink your proposed "mundane" archetypes to not trip over those limitations, and specialize your spellcasters. Or to be more concise: write a bunch more classes to replace the existing few. Swordsman, Dragonknight, Primal Warrior: all of those give you hooks to hang mechanics on the fighter is simultaneously too broad and too limited to support. Similarly, Fire Mage, Necromancer, Forest Witch provide significantly more clarity to the caster role, and let you draw more sensible lines around what techniques they can't access.

There is no way out that ends with a Fighter and a Wizard.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I have another question: for whom is this fix supposed to be? What segment of the gaming population? So far several suggestions have been offered, and the arguments against have boiled down to "some people won't like that solution". I know, I made several of those arguments. Is this supposed to go into a book? How is the solution intended to be distributed, and what about the people who don't like it, but still have the problem?

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

This feels like a big one to me - what are teh levels of ability the usual people would think were outstandingly good, but not mystical. Olympic athlete? Hawkeye and Blackwidow? Blackpanther? Captain America?

The follow-up question I have is one I also have for wizards. How common is this among the non-adventurers? If the upper limits are Hawkeye/Black Widow, are those the kind of people that would be in that world's Olympics too?

I was thinking of this.

To me Usain Bolt is the fastest person on Earth. I can’t imagine running that fast and the average person doesn’t have a chance of doing so. If, in Faerun, for example, the average person was the same speed but the fastest person was twice as fast as Usain, it wouldn’t be any more unimaginable. Part of it it just raising the bar for what’s possible in a fantasy setting.

I think, too, that making magic users ‘less magical’ at tier 1 would help to make get the feel that high level heroes are truly paragons of what mortals can be. If all of tier 1 play was more mundane where wizards used utility spells like divinations or subtle effects to sway the battle but at higher level did the typical universe altering stuff, it would reinforce that feeling.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

I have another question: for whom is this fix supposed to be? What segment of the gaming population? So far several suggestions have been offered, and the arguments against have boiled down to "some people won't like that solution". I know, I made several of those arguments. Is this supposed to go into a book? How is the solution intended to be distributed, and what about the people who don't like it, but still have the problem?

I’m just brainstorming ideas as it pertains to the OP. I haven’t really considered whether this would ever become a reality in any setting or game.

 

[Cadence]

Assuming mundane isn't mundane is definitely not a solution that will work for everybody.

Are Hawkeye and Blackwidow and Kingpin and Okoye mundane in Marvel Comics? (As in, no cybernetics, no mutant powers, no magic, no divinity, no alien blood?) They're usually treated as such by the other heroes in those universes.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

Two solutions I like:

1. Go back to TSR-style spellcasting restrictions and/or dangerous spellcasting. Obvious it doesn't have to be exactly the same, but making it harder to learn, find, and cast spells provides balance without having to do a lot of nerfing of spells (probably a little nerfing though). Combine this with actually letting fighters be the best at fighting (through higher numbers, bringing back a multiple cleave mechanic, or some other way), and Bob's your uncle.

I think this goes towards my idea of making wizards feel more ‘mundane’ at lower tiers.