Unpopular opinions go here

[Tony Vargas]

So, since you seem to be so adept at this, where so many others (including a lot of academics) have failed, why don't you explain this grand unified theory to the rest of us as if we were slightly dumb golden retrievers.

Sorry, I'm a cat person.

Seriously, though (or as seriously as merits inclusion in unpopular-opinions), I phrased it as we need a tighter, more workable definition of TTRPG that's not distorted by the reflexive need to include D&D let alone "everything," for the very simple reason that I don't have one. So, yeah, I think it'd likey exclude early D&D, but y'know the cut-off might be 3e or 2e or late 1e or somewhere in the BECMI letters? IDK.

I'm pretty confident about pure freestyle RP not being a game, tho. I mean, no rules, no a game? Is that too uncontroversial to even mention here.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Sorry, I'm a cat person.

Seriously, though (or as seriously as merits inclusion in unpopular-opinions), I phrased it as we need a tighter, more workable definition of TTRPG that's not distorted by the reflexive need to include D&D let alone "everything," for the very simple reason that I don't have one. So, yeah, I think it'd likey exclude early D&D, but y'know the cut-off might be 3e or 2e or late 1e or somewhere in the BECMI letters? IDK.

I'm pretty confident about pure freestyle RP not being a game, tho. I mean, no rules, no a game? Is that too uncontroversial to even mention here.

So in other words, your definition is- I know it when I see it. And my opinion is that the things I know to be true(tm) are the correct definition, for, um, reasons. But I haven't actually given any thought to what that would entail, because that would take reading and work and looking at what other people have done. Like, you know, how people actually have defined RPGs.

 

[Tony Vargas]

My unpopular opinion is that we need a tighter, more workable definition of TTRPG. One that's not constrained by D&D's "first RPG" status, nor by the impulse to just retreat into subjectivity.

 

[overgeeked]

I'm pretty confident about pure freestyle RP not being a game, tho. I mean, no rules, no a game? Is that too uncontroversial to even mention here.

You're incorrectly assuming freestyle RP doesn't have rules. It does.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

My unpopular opinion is that we need a tighter, more workable definition of TTRPG. One that's not constrained by D&D's "first RPG" status, nor by the impulse to just retreat into subjectivity.

....okay, let's try this again.

Which of the various definitions of "TTRPG" or even "RPG" do you disagree with, and why. Feel free to use any of the various academic sources I have posted over time. Or another source. Feel free to explain why you disagree with the definition used, and why you think, for current purposes, a different definition would work better.

As a bonus, explain what definition (used by others) would operationally exclude "pre-2e D&D" but include other TTRPGs.

 

[Tony Vargas]

You're incorrectly assuming freestyle RP doesn't have rules. It does.

I'm sorry, but freestyle...

 

[overgeeked]

I'm sorry, but freestyle...

So you don't actually freestyle RP then I take it. There are plenty of rules. Things like "don't godmod other PCs" is one example. "Stick with the genre" is another. Rules aren't limited to dice and stats.

 

[Tony Vargas]

So you don't actually freestyle RP then I take it. There are plenty of rules. Things like "don't godmod other PCs" is one example. "Stick with the genre" is another. Rules aren't limited to dice and stats.

My experience with freestyle rp is as a fallback position ttrpgs resort to when the system's scope/utility is exceeded, or the group has imbibed too much ROLE-not-ROLL juice.

If there's an actual published product called "Freestyle Roleplaying" I hadn't heard of it.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

My experience with freestyle rp is as a fallback position ttrpgs resort to when the system's scope/utility is exceeded, or the group has imbibed too much ROLE-not-ROLE juice.

If there's an actual published product called "Freestyle Roleplaying" I hadn't heard of it.

There are numerous games, from Amber Diceless RPG (and similar games) to the entirety of the FKR/Rules-Lite RPGs that we often discuss here.

Your lack of knowledge of these games does not, in fact, make them not-games.

ETA- in addition, you originally stated that you didn't think "Storygames" were RPGs. Storygames are, of course, another entire branch of modern RPGs.

 

[overgeeked]

My experience with freestyle rp is as a fallback position ttrpgs resort to when the system's scope/utility is exceeded, or the group has imbibed too much ROLE-not-ROLE juice.

Sure. And even there you have plenty of rules. Stay with your one character, don't try to control another player's character, don't exceed what your character could do, stick with the genre, stick with the already established reality of the game, etc.

If there's an actual published product called "Freestyle Roleplaying" I hadn't heard of it.

Roleplaying without mechanics is a common thing. Freestyle, freeform, pure RP...whatever it's called. It's also been around longer than D&D. One of Jon Peterson's books (Elusive Shift...I think?) talks about how it was already an established thing in the sci-fi fandom before D&D launched.