D&D 5E [+] Ways to fix the caster / non-caster gap

[overgeeked]

Because the PCs aren't special. They're inhabitants of their setting just like everyone else in said setting; and as such have the same abilities open to them under the same conditions as do those other inhabitants.

According to 5E they are and this is a thread about 5E. As quoted above. The world, along with everything and everyone in it, is infused with magic. And the mechanics of the game explicitly show that they are special. Quite special when compared to your average Joe in the setting.

 

[Micah Sweet]

According to 5E they are and this is a thread about 5E. As quoted above. The world, along with everything and everyone in it, is infused with magic.

Not my 5e. You must be thinking of WotC.

 

[Lanefan]

I mean, what's wrong with fantasy worlds just having a narrative of "Some people are given hidden blessings by the gods. These people can grow in stature, skill, and will from risk. danger and exposure to the evils of the world to grow into people who can challenge the gods themselves".

For one specific campaign? Fine, no problem. Bring it on.

As the default for every campaign? Sorry, not interested.

 

[Cadence]

Not my 5e. You must be thinking of WotC.

You mean the default, non-house-ruled published, official one that is probably the only one a thread could ever reasonably take as the baseline WotC one?

(I mean, I don't use it either in play, I mod stuff... but for discussion purposes, it feels good to start with?)

 

[Micah Sweet]

You mean the default, non-house rules, published, official one that is probably the only one a thread could ever reasonably take as the baseline WotC one?

(I mean, I don't use it either in play, I mod stuff... but for discussion purposes, it feels good to start with?)

Yeah, that one. It's not my fault everyone's assumes it, and if you start a thread and want no responses that don't track back to WotC and its choices, say so in the OP please. There's lots of 5e out there.

 

[Lanefan]

So, consider the purely hypothetical alternative...
D&D, in a fantasy setting, there are dragons and other magical monsters (including once-mortals who have crossed a line, like a lich or a warlock who has surrendered soul & free will to become a magic-wielding tool of some devil/fey/GOO/whatever), there are gods and other supernatural powers above mortals, and there are magical items placed in the world by such beings to tempt, bedevil, aid, or just mess with mortals. All PCs are mere mortals. Martial characters, much as they are or were in some preferred edition. Casters, OTOH, like 1e magic-users, must devote themselves to the study of the arcane/divine, from early childhood into middle age to even have a chance of gaining magical powers, lifetimes of study, conteplation, and/or prayer, with no time or effort spared to become proficient with mundane armor, weapons, or tools (caligraphy or something like that, sure), nor physical or social skills of any kind, in return, the learn the magical secrets available to mortals - knowledge of magic & suprenatural beings, including rituals that offer some protection from them or invoke them for aid (rarely answered) or bargaining (tho mortals have little to offer but their souls or servitude, which means no longer a PC), and how to use appropriate magic items. When such aspirants become frustrated with their lack of progress, they may well go out adventuring in the hopes of finding a magic item that may grant them the kinds of powers they seek. The ability to use such items also being a benefit of the class.

Imagine that's what D&D has been for, like, 48 of the last 50 years. How would fixing the caster/martial gap in that hypothetical scenario sound?

I'm not sure there's much of a gap needs fixing in that scenario.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Oh, I dunno - some malls I've seen, most of those things could happen to Bob during his first week on the job!

Lol. If that's the case, I'd wager good money that Bob is more than meets the eye.

 

[MichaelSomething]

Yeah, that one. It's not my fault everyone's assumes it, and if you start a thread and want no responses that don't track back to WotC and its choices, say so in the OP please. There's lots of 5e out there.

So rewriting the base lore of 5E is a nessercery step in addressing the martial/caster divide??

 

[tetrasodium]

You mean the default, non-house-ruled published, official one that is probably the only one a thread could ever reasonably take as the baseline WotC one?

(I mean, I don't use it either in play, I mod stuff... but for discussion purposes, it feels good to start with?)

Got a quote on that? I feel like some of these claims have been pushing vague implications about PCs being heroes in the PHB &overinflating them to toxic Main Character levels. Doing a quick search of the PHB the closest I found was pg16 where it says this:
"In the third tier (levels 11-16), characters have reached a level of power that sets them high above the ordinary populace and makes them special even among adventurers. At 11th level, many spellcasters At the fourth tier (levels 17-20), characters achieve the pinnacle of their class features, becoming heroic (or villainous) archetypes in their own right. The fate of the world or even the fundamental order of the multiverse might hang in the balance during their adventures.". That doesn't exclude NPCs from existing on that power-scale from being fairly common in the regions of the world where PCs of those levels adventure.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Mostly because despite their abilities most of the characters - even the most powerful - are largely still relatable-to as (fictionally) real people, and it's easy to imagine their fitting in with the commoners in the setting should they choose to do so.

For mages, the nearest it gets are the sorcerers at Qarth I think; though a game system would need to expand on/explain their powers into playable game terms. Failing that, it would be a pretty short jump to turn the Maesters into spellcasters - the whole learning and guild structure is already in place, nust need to give them spells.

For Cleric types there's a number of exemplars: Melisandre and Dondarrion as Clerics and the wildling skinchanger (whose name I forget right now) as a Druid...or end-game Bran as a Druid of sorts.

For the record, I can agree that there is fun to be had in such a low magic setting.

From a spellcasting exemplar perspective, it sounds like there is very little that is usable in its current form.

This doesn't seem any closer to "D&D" than the MCU to me, but if there's balance to be had there, that's great.

It would certainly save us a ton of space in the monster manual, as a great many of the beasts in it should be functionally invulnerable to parties made up of GoT characters.