D&D (2024) Do you plan to adopt D&D5.5One2024Redux?

[Parmandur]

We don’t have the 2024 presentation, but we do have the playtest documents. The playtest backgrounds are completely lacking in a feature that explicitly gives the player permission to posit connections for their character with the game world related to their background. I’d say that’s not very encouraging of play that’s interested in such things.

We have two pages of Backgrounds from the PHB in layout with art thst were shown at PAX. They haven't changed the text substantially from the UA, which is to be expected as the Origins UA got big satisfaction numbers.

But it is all right there implicitly, and the problem with the "explicit" presentation is that it isn't always going to work in the fiction. In practice, I don't see any difference in how these will play out: any reasonable DM, and by thst I mean even a newbie 12 year old who just got the books, is going to read what's in the below pages and allow basically the same as theybwould in the prior prescriptive "feature".

 

[Parmandur]

There are no published adventures that renders a background feature useless. There are DMs that might not be able to figure out how to incorporate the background feature. Or there are DMs that don't want to do the extra work it will take to incorporate the background feature. But there are zero backgrounds that are useless in a published campaign adventure from WotC.

The thing is, when you are in a situation like Oofta describes, the narrow prescriptions of the "Feature" don't apply...but in my experience it is normal for a player and DM to negotiate something about what might be reasonable based on the Backgroudn. Like, the Criminal is not going to magically always have a reliable contact across the world...but theybhavr the Streetwise ability to work their way into the underworld through games of chance and ingratiating conversation that the Acolyte Paladon would not, even with 18 Charisma.

And that is not inhibited by the changes. Probsvly encourages, even.

 

[Parmandur]

I also don’t think 5E needs to be redesigned to protect it from new players

I mean, the game is designed to be for new players, specifically teenagers...?

 

[Scott Christian]

Then we simply disagree. It's not that you can't get any benefit from a background beyond proficiencies. A noble for example will have insight into how nobility works for example which can be useful wherever they go. But there's no magic enforcing background features and if it makes no sense from a story perspective, it doesn't.

Your bold is an example of what I am talking about. I am not so sure we disagree. I think you might be drawing a straight line while I draw a curvy one.

 

[Parmandur]

Your bold is an example of what I am talking about. I am not so sure we disagree. I think you might be drawing a straight line while I draw a curvy one.

And that's why I, for one, don't see a substantial difference between the 2014 and 2024 presentation of Background: I expect it to work exactly the same in practice.

 

[Scott Christian]

The thing is, when you are in a situation like Oofta describes, the narrow prescriptions of the "Feature" don't apply...but in my experience it is normal for a player and DM to negotiate something about what might be reasonable based on the Backgroudn. Like, the Criminal is not going to magically always have a reliable contact across the world...but theybhavr the Streetwise ability to work their way into the underworld through games of chance and ingratiating conversation that the Acolyte Paladon would not, even with 18 Charisma.

And that is not inhibited by the changes. Probsvly encourages, even.

Yeah, I understand. But background features are, at worst, still so open ended that they could be used at some point during a long campaign. A one shot, definitely not. Not even a little four-parter. But an entire campaign, levels 1-10, you mean to tell me as a DM you can't figure out how to sneak their background in just once? (That is probably 20-30 sessions!) It's something I can't agree with.

 

[tetrasodium]

Yeah, I understand. But background features are, at worst, still so open ended that they could be used at some point during a long campaign. A one shot, definitely not. Not even a little four-parter. But an entire campaign, levels 1-10, you mean to tell me as a DM you can't figure out how to sneak their background in just once? (That is probably 20-30 sessions!) It's something I can't agree with.

I'm not sure that I understand what you are trying to get at. Can you clarify if you are saying that background features should have more of an impact on a one shot/4 parter/premade HC adventure or something else?

 

[Parmandur]

Yeah, I understand. But background features are, at worst, still so open ended that they could be used at some point during a long campaign. A one shot, definitely not. Not even a little four-parter. But an entire campaign, levels 1-10, you mean to tell me as a DM you can't figure out how to sneak their background in just once? (That is probably 20-30 sessions!) It's something I can't agree with.

Sure, absolutely: thing is, I don't see how the new presentation changes that in the slightest, other than massaging some hamfisted game-y language in favor of more natural language description...?

 

[Scott Christian]

I'm not sure that I understand what you are trying to get at. Can you clarify if you are saying that background features should have more of an impact on a one shot/4 parter/premade HC adventure or something else?

Sorry. I should probably restate my claim so it is clearer.

There are no background features in a campaign (even a published one like Ravenloft) that are useless. The DM can easily allow that background feature to shine at least once, but probably several times over the course of a campaign. I was replying to this comment:

If a group decides to use a prewritten adventure that renders a player’s choice of background feature useless, then that group probably isn’t very interested in the type of fiction supported by background features.

 

[tetrasodium]

Sorry. I should probably restate my claim so it is clearer.

There are no background features in a campaign (even a published one like Ravenloft) that are useless. The DM can easily allow that background feature to shine at least once, but probably several times over the course of a campaign. I was replying to this comment:

IMO a player should very much not have an expectation of their background contributing anything noteworthy enough to "shine" on it's own. The 2014 5e BIFTS+background section really missed the boat in suggesting otherwise. Without counting all of the pages dedicated to them in the various splatbooks the PHB alone devotes like 15 pages to background beyond the well poisoning mentions of background across three of the five steps in ch1 "step by step character creation" (2 4 & 5). Compare that to 4e where backgrounds get roughly a quarter page

Spoiler: 4e phb24 background

Background
Your character’s background often stays there—in the
background. What’s most important about your char-
acter is what you do in the course of your adventures,
not what happened to you in the past. Even so, think-
ing about your birthplace, family, and upbringing can
help you decide how to play your character.
These questions can help you start thinking about
your background.
✦ Why did you decide to be an adventurer?
✦ How did you acquire your class? If you’re a fighter,
for example, you might have been in a militia, come
from a family of soldiers, or trained in a martial
school, or you might be a self-taught warrior.
✦ How did you acquire your starting equipment? Did
you assemble it piece by piece over time? Was it a
gift from a parent or a mentor? Do any of your per-
sonal items have special significance?
✦ What’s the worst event of your life?
✦ What’s the best thing that’s ever happened to you?
✦ Do you stay in contact with your family? What do
your relatives think of you and your chosen career?
in 3.5PHB110 had similar with many of the same questions

That Right out of the gate the player is given a clear image of background's purpose & directs them to focus more important things that might be relevant to a starting PC or the established adventurer they might live long enough to become. Now 5e backgrounds are more about directing the player to establish "your place in the world" with background features worded in a way that tends to imply they should override the GM's worldbuilding/adventure planning. Those questions are technically there on phb 125but now they are structured in a paragraph that encourages a feedback loop that weirdly turbocharges the foregrounded background with actual worldbuilding.