Remathilis
Legend
And we're back to letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.I rest my case.
D&D (2024) D&D species article
- Thread starter MonsterEnvy
- Start date
Maxperson
Morkus from Orkus
As you note, those with elven and/or maia blood lived longer than even the blessed long lifespans of the average numenorean. Neither Elros nor Elrond ever ceased to be half-elven. They were only mortal or not from their choices. Their mixed heritage remained.
Maxperson
Morkus from Orkus
No. No CR system yet made has been good. I've had to ignore all of them and do things on my own.
Parmandur
Book-Friend, he/him
OK, so comparing Karl David Brown's brilliant reverse engineered analysis of the OG Elves ( Race Design for D&D 5th Edition Creating New PC Species - Dungeon Masters Guild | Dungeon Masters Guild ), using his notation each Rave got 12 "points", with half of thiae being ASI now moced to Background:
So the only important feature in the main Elf Race is Perception Proficency, which is maintained with a versatile choice in the new PHB Wlf, so 2 points for both. Plus some ribbons.
Other than the ASI, High Elf brings the Weapon Profs (2 points), a Cantrip (2 points), and some ribbons. 4 points worth, again ignoring ASI.
Other than the ASI, the Woof Elf provides weapon Profs (2 points), a Speed boost (0.5 points), and Mask of the Wild (1.5 Points). So 4 points aside from ASI qnd aome ribbons.
Other than ASI, the Drow gets a whopping -7 points added for Sunlight Sensitivity, which h theybuse to provide weapon Profs (2 points), a cantrip (2 points), and 2 combat spells that come into play 2 Levels after a Wizard gets access (7 points). So due to Sunlight Sensitivty, the Drow comes in at an 11 point value ignoring ASI, plus the Darkvision ribbon.
This is interesting, as the Drow is largely unchanged in 2014 other than loaong Sunlight sensitivity(+7 points) and their weapon Profs (-5 points), for a total point value of 9 points for the Lineage. And the new Wood Elf and High Elf are symmetrical with that.
So in this system, the old Race-Subrace Combos all came in at 6 points plus some ribbons (and 6 points of ASI now moced to Background), but using the same analytical approach the new Elves are all 11 points worth plus some ribbons.
So, uh, yeah. The 2024 Elf is a good deal better than the 2014 Elf. And I think Karl David Brown has some work to re-figure his reverse engineering for what WotC ia doing with Species now.
So the only important feature in the main Elf Race is Perception Proficency, which is maintained with a versatile choice in the new PHB Wlf, so 2 points for both. Plus some ribbons.
Other than the ASI, High Elf brings the Weapon Profs (2 points), a Cantrip (2 points), and some ribbons. 4 points worth, again ignoring ASI.
Other than the ASI, the Woof Elf provides weapon Profs (2 points), a Speed boost (0.5 points), and Mask of the Wild (1.5 Points). So 4 points aside from ASI qnd aome ribbons.
Other than ASI, the Drow gets a whopping -7 points added for Sunlight Sensitivity, which h theybuse to provide weapon Profs (2 points), a cantrip (2 points), and 2 combat spells that come into play 2 Levels after a Wizard gets access (7 points). So due to Sunlight Sensitivty, the Drow comes in at an 11 point value ignoring ASI, plus the Darkvision ribbon.
This is interesting, as the Drow is largely unchanged in 2014 other than loaong Sunlight sensitivity(+7 points) and their weapon Profs (-5 points), for a total point value of 9 points for the Lineage. And the new Wood Elf and High Elf are symmetrical with that.
So in this system, the old Race-Subrace Combos all came in at 6 points plus some ribbons (and 6 points of ASI now moced to Background), but using the same analytical approach the new Elves are all 11 points worth plus some ribbons.
So, uh, yeah. The 2024 Elf is a good deal better than the 2014 Elf. And I think Karl David Brown has some work to re-figure his reverse engineering for what WotC ia doing with Species now.
Chaosmancer
Legend
Accommodations like... telling you that any one of those statblocks can have the information from the species added into them? I don't get what you are going for here. Orcs can't be tougher than a human commoner unless a human commoner statblock and an orc commoner statblock are both printed? You just jumped into this conversation demanding commoner statblocks be printed.
Parmandur
Book-Friend, he/him
As for the Dwarf, the below should make it clear that by increasing rhw Dwarven Speed, even dropping all the weapon, armor and tool Profa, the new Dwarf is quite competitive with the Elf with their HP bonus, Poison resistance and expanded Stonecunning with Tremorsense:
The new Species passed my initial smell test, but looking at them closer theybare way souped up.
The new Species passed my initial smell test, but looking at them closer theybare way souped up.
Micah Sweet
Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
Not what I said. I hope that the new PH includes info about adding species mechanics to NPC statblocks, preferably with statistics, or very few people will bother doing it on their own.
Remathilis
Legend
Yes, the 24 elf is better than the 2014 elf. We established that.
How do they measure against the MotM and AAG elves?
Parmandur
Book-Friend, he/him
- Perception: 2 points
- Cantrip: 2 points
- Misty Step: 2 points
- Trance prof swap: ?
- ribbons
The reverse engineered system only covers up to Tasha's, but even if the Prof swap makes the Astral Elves better than 2014...the new 2024 options are superior.
Remathilis
Legend
I'm calling BS.
Trance prof swap should be worth at least a free proficiency in a s skill and a tool, and probably more (at least 1.5 times). And "misty step" 2-6 times per day with no components while still being able to cast a leveled spell is only 2 points? That system is borked and horribly outdated.
You've only proved attempts to reverse engineer any mathematical logic into the species system don't work.
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