D&D General 5e D&D to OSR pipeline or circle?

[TwoSix]

Thinking about this combo a little more, @Whizbang Dustyboots, and I'm not sure that I could do this mix-up properly as my first instinct is inevitably to toss out D&D's six attributes in favor of four (as per, for example, Shadow of the Demon Lord).

My first thought would be to use Shadowdark's simplified 5e engine. Then design about a dozen playbooks, a la BTW; each playbook would provide your starting stats and a randomized subset of starting class abilities, and also provide your 2d6 table of level up talents as well as possible spells/rituals. Basically, make each playbook its own "class", although similar concepts in playbooks could share mechanics.

 

[zakael19]

I mean, "why don't I like this style of play I don't like?" isn't really a question we can answer for you.

I do think the question you posed earlier, about why there isn't a strand of OSR development focused on evolving Hickman revolution story play with a more rules-light chassis, is an interesting one. My gut feeling would be simply because a lot of mainstream RPGs are still trad/story play oriented, and those kind of games also favor deeper and more complex character creation, which is a niche that games like 5e and PF2 already fill.

Dolmenwood has some of this as a strand in their GM book. Provides “campaign types” as player driven (sandbox), plot driven, and mixed. It’s got suggestions for milestone leveling, campaign themes, all the factional conflicts/desires/“what they might ask players to do” & etc. You could run a very story-based campaign using the material provided.

 

[Aldarc]

My first thought would be to use Shadowdark's simplified 5e engine. Then design about a dozen playbooks, a la BTW; each playbook would provide your starting stats and a randomized subset of starting class abilities, and also provide your 2d6 table of level up talents as well as possible spells/rituals. Basically, make each playbook its own "class", although similar concepts in playbooks could share mechanics.

Playbooks with base stats that are then modified by additional rolls in char gen would work. That said, I'm still not a fan of randomized character progression so I would probably toss those too.

 

[TwoSix]

Playbooks with base stats that are then modified by additional rolls in char gen would work. That said, I'm still not a fan of randomized character progression so I would probably toss those too.

Fair. I love randomized progression myself (certainly in the context of an OSR game), so ideally I'd like to see it there.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Realistically, it was changing during the '80s as the "Hickman revolution", and a focus on playing through stories and more detailed characters took hold. I think it became the de facto assumption during the heavy trad '90s (although gamer communities are islands, especially pre-internet, and there have always been a ton of isolated enclaves), and the idea only started to get re-interrogated during the rise of the OSR in the early to mid '00s.

I still know plenty of players who are strongly opposed to any sort of "out-of-character" metagaming, simply because they aren't familiar with the concepts that we're discussing here that have become more prevalent over the past 15-20 years.

To be fair, there are plenty of people who are familiar with those concepts and still don't want out of character metagaming. Perhaps because their prevalence doesn't overcome preference.

 

[Aldarc]

Fair. I love randomized progression myself (certainly in the context of an OSR game), so ideally I'd like to see it there.

I'm okay with finding random loot in the game world; however, randomized progression in terms of character abilities per level is a big reason why I am NOT playing Shadowdark in the first place.

 

[Remathilis]

I mean, "why don't I like this style of play I don't like?" isn't really a question we can answer for you.

I do think the question you posed earlier, about why there isn't a strand of OSR development focused on evolving Hickman revolution story play with a more rules-light chassis, is an interesting one. My gut feeling would be simply because a lot of mainstream RPGs are still trad/story play oriented, and those kind of games also favor deeper and more complex character creation, which is a niche that games like 5e and PF2 already fill.

I legit wonder if there is a market for a lighter ruleset with the more 2nd edition style of storytelling. I'm thinking of something closer to AD&D 3rd edition; less crunchy than actual 3e but still felt the need to innovate on things like Stats, AC or balance.

My favorite OS game is Basic Fantasy. It was an attempt to marry B/X with elements of 3e (like upwards AC and separate race/class). It wasn't perfect (nothing is) but at the time, it felt like someone wasn't just copying Basic slavishly, but trying to innovate on it to take ideas from more modern D&D. I'd love to see that go further. And I'd love to see it married to a more Hickman style of story and character development.

 

[mamba]

My favorite OS game is Basic Fantasy. It was an attempt to marry B/X with elements of 3e (like upwards AC and separate race/class). It wasn't perfect (nothing is) but at the time, it felt like someone wasn't just copying Basic slavishly, but trying to innovate on it to take ideas from more modern D&D. I'd love to see that go further. And I'd love to see it married to a more Hickman style of story and character development.

yeah, I really do not need another BX / 1e clone, got enough of those already (with OSE and Hyperborea probably leading the pack for me), I want an evolution off 2e, not a step back from there

OSRIC 3e and Labyrinth Lord 2e etc. are not interesting to me.

One OSR-ish game I am interested in (did not back, only stumbled across it since) is Vagabond. No idea how it will turn out or how much I would like it, but at least it got me interested

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/landoftheblind/development-for-vagabond-ttrpg

 

[Micah Sweet]

I'm okay with finding random loot in the game world; however, randomized progression in terms of character abilities per level is a big reason why I am NOT playing Shadowdark in the first place.

I actually find that exciting. It's one of the things in Shadowdark that draw me to the game.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I legit wonder if there is a market for a lighter ruleset with the more 2nd edition style of storytelling. I'm thinking of something closer to AD&D 3rd edition; less crunchy than actual 3e but still felt the need to innovate on things like Stats, AC or balance.

My favorite OS game is Basic Fantasy. It was an attempt to marry B/X with elements of 3e (like upwards AC and separate race/class). It wasn't perfect (nothing is) but at the time, it felt like someone wasn't just copying Basic slavishly, but trying to innovate on it to take ideas from more modern D&D. I'd love to see that go further. And I'd love to see it married to a more Hickman style of story and character development.

The original version of Hackmaster described itself as "3rd ed AD&D".