The D&D 4th edition Rennaissaince: A look into the history of the edition, its flaws and its merits

[Jacob Lewis]

 

[UnplayedRanger]

4th Edition was my first introduction to DND, so it will always have a soft spot in my heart. I miss the monster stat blocks, those should be industry standard.

 

[Tigris]

I mean the clickbait article worked. We’ve been baited. But I have read better post-mortems of 4e here and on RPGNet.

Well that may be true, but there are now really again more videos and other things being posted about 4E the last months and such blogs and especially videos (even with wrong information) will just reach more people than forum posts.


This one is not even the first one in the last 7 days. And these posts are at least not as bad as Jon Peterson's "Interview" with the 4E lead designers last yer during the 50 year of D&D event...

 

[pedr]

An Essentials discussion in 2024….at least no one has brought up the Warlord.

There is no 4e resurgence or “renaissance”. There was an old school one. When 4e came out.

The Old School ... whatever ... was a reaction to 3rd edition, really, rather than 4th. OSRIC was created using the OGL as a way to enable the creation of 1e-compatible material and old-school play. The more established OSR did become more visible during the 4e era but that's primarily due to improved access to self-publishing, Print on Demand, PDF distribution through DriveThru and RPGNow, etc. Third party products during 3e still often required a large investment in printing and the complexities of distribution.

None of that changes the fact that 4e didn't meet the financial goals WotC set for it, while Pathfinder was perfectly able to support Paizo's growth. The difference is that the revenue that's needed from an expensive project at a subsidiary of one of the world's largest toy companies is significantly more than the revenue Paizo needed to generate to consider Pathfinder an amazing success.

So I don't know whether WotC was seeking to license D&D or sell it off towards the end of 4e. But it's easy to forget that the design of 5e was pretty clearly aimed at creating a game which could continue without too much attention after it was created. The open discussion of the play of all of the previous editions by the design team, the early discussions of modularity, even if they didn't get into the final game, the release schedule and approach to support at launch, etc mean my view is WotC leadership were getting ready to divert the bulk of their resources to Magic, with D&D 5e existing as the last edition: a pretty good attempt at distilling the previous 40 years of the game into something that could carry on without any attention. Then a few years after launch they suddenly had a hit on their hand, helped by Stranger Things, Critical Role, Twitch and other social media etc, so plans and approaches have changed and we've ended up with the 5e we have now.

 

[Joshua Randall]

And these posts are at least not as bad as Jon Peterson's "Interview" with the 4E lead designers last yer during the 50 year of D&D event...

John Peterson is an embarrassment to real journalists and real historians everywhere.

Sightation: (1) I was a real journalist in my younger days; (2) my father taught graduate level history for decades.

 

[Reynard]

There is no 4e resurgence or “renaissance”. There was an old school one. When 4e came out.

I mean, how would you know if you don't follow discussions in those circles? Matt Colville certainly liked it well enough to highlight it and use its design ethos in both Flee Mortals and his new game.

Also, it isn't a competition. A "4E renaissance" does not diminish the existence of the ongoing Old School Renaissance.

 

[Mistwell]

John Peterson is an embarrassment to real journalists and real historians everywhere.

Sightation: (1) I was a real journalist in my younger days; (2) my father taught graduate level history for decades.

Is there some reason every post you're making in here is so aggressive?

 

[Joshua Randall]

Is there some reason every post you're making in here is so aggressive?

To counteract the B.S.

 

[Mistwell]

To counteract the B.S.

It's not working, at least from my perspective, when you're over the top angry and the posts you respond to are casual and calm. I've seen you disagree with people plenty of times without this level of angst. It's why I asked what was up.

 

[Joshua Randall]

It's not working, at least from my perspective, when you're over the top angry and the posts you respond to are casual and calm. I've seen you disagree with people plenty of times without this level of angst. It's why I asked what was up.

Well I appreciate the concern and I’ll try to tone it down.

But if you (not you specifically, the generic you) want to get under my skin, please continue to dredge up the same demonstrably false 4e hate that destroyed this forum and others 15 years ago.