D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

[mamba]

... or in the market.
... or in how you've related to the market between releases.

if this were due to the market or self-inflicted, then it should affect ‘current’ 2014 sales as well. If those were fine but 2024 are not, then that rules out external circumstances that should affect both of them equally

The RPG world is different than it was a decade ago. Just saying, "it is the rules" would be a simplistic, possibly even naïve, take on it.

I am not comparing it to a decade ago, the 2014 PHB was still being sold in 2024

 

[Incenjucar]

I expect that D&D is at a stage where it is not going to be able to create its own hype outside of its existing audience barring some sort of impossible to predict event. It will get spikes with new editions and new media external to itself (Harry Potter, Dark Souls, etc.) but it's not primed for innovation or experimentation in its current form. Related media like BG3 and the movie help, but they're not good at capitalizing on it, and produce very little.

 

[MothMayI]

It's easy to just dismiss criticism of something new as just disliking "change" when you're not negatively affected by said changes.

If you played a character in Adventurer's League who had abilities you made frequent use of scrapped simply because someone who doesn't like the class and didn't have to play it demanded those features be removed, then you'd obviously have a reasonable criticism against change.

If the new edition meant to celebrate D&D destroys your character to please a tiny subset of players who answered a survey, then you'd be right to be displeased with change.

At the end of the day, we'll see whether an edition built to please a group of survey-respondents will perform compared to the edition that happened to spark an explosion of popularity by winning the interest of people outside the previous niche.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

It's easy to just dismiss criticism of something new as just disliking "change" when you're not negatively affected by said changes.

If you played a character in Adventurer's League who had abilities you made frequent use of scrapped simply because someone who doesn't like the class and didn't have to play it demanded those features be removed, then you'd obviously have a reasonable criticism against change.

If the new edition meant to celebrate D&D destroys your character to please a tiny subset of players who answered a survey, then you'd be right to be displeased with change.

At the end of the day, we'll see whether an edition built to please a group of survey-respondents will perform compared to the edition that happened to spark an explosion of popularity by winning the interest of people outside the previous niche.

Is there anything preventing you from porting that character into a home game? Maybe some other folks from your Adventurer’s League location that feel the same way.

 

[Shardstone]

I expect that D&D is at a stage where it is not going to be able to create its own hype outside of its existing audience barring some sort of impossible to predict event. It will get spikes with new editions and new media external to itself (Harry Potter, Dark Souls, etc.) but it's not primed for innovation or experimentation in its current form. Related media like BG3 and the movie help, but they're not good at capitalizing on it, and produce very little.

The biggest truth here is that WotC SUCKS at capitalizing on things. BG3 passed them by and they missed out on so much. Once the launch date was set, they could have easily created another tie in adventure or supplement on DND Beyond connecting it. They did nothing! And have done nothing since! Wtf?!

 

[Hussar]

The text of the book is unfortunately rather silent on the issue, but the back cover isn't:
View attachment 401395

There's a difference between "can make a profit" and "can make enough profit to satisfy Hasbro execs." 3PPs can often produce things Wizards can't, because they have less overhead and don't have shareholders they need to satisfy.

Again, "optional" doesn't mean core or not core. After all, a broad swath of the 2e PHB was specifically called out as optional.

But, that's the point I keep making. There was no such thing as "core" books until 3e coined the term.

 

[Hussar]

I feel like you're contradicting yourself here. You say people should play what they want, but then you strongly imply that not being all on board with the latest changes is bad behavior.

Not at all. You can hate the new changes all you like. That's groovy. Have zero problem with that.

But, why tell everyone how much you hate the new changes over and over and over again? Why waste all the time and energy telling everyone else that their game sucks?

That's the bad behavior I'm talking about.

 

[Hussar]

It's easy to just dismiss criticism of something new as just disliking "change" when you're not negatively affected by said changes.

If you played a character in Adventurer's League who had abilities you made frequent use of scrapped simply because someone who doesn't like the class and didn't have to play it demanded those features be removed, then you'd obviously have a reasonable criticism against change.

If the new edition meant to celebrate D&D destroys your character to please a tiny subset of players who answered a survey, then you'd be right to be displeased with change.

At the end of the day, we'll see whether an edition built to please a group of survey-respondents will perform compared to the edition that happened to spark an explosion of popularity by winning the interest of people outside the previous niche.

Just to be clear here, I don't think anyone has a problem with someone saying, "Hey, this new thing in the game? I don't like that." That's perfectly fine. For me, it would be the increase in the amount of magic that is used in 5e. It's something I've long had an issue with. And, if people want to discuss this particular issue, I'm more than willing to do so.

What I don't do is jump into thread after thread after thread decrying how WotC has ruined the game and how everyone who enjoys the game as written is just wrong.

IOW, there's nothing wrong with criticism. Criticism is fine. Endlessly bitching over and over again and dragging out your particular drum every single time something even remotely touches on your personal beef is what's being called out here. That is what is so exhausting.

 

[KYRON45]

Certainly in terms of physical attributes the 5e books aren't very high quality. They rather notoriously fall apart easily and are made very cheaply. But I don't think that's what you mean either.

I’ve got 1e books from the 80’s that have seen years of abuse and are still in excellent condition.

 

[Kromanjon]

You overreacted here

Please don’t assume my level of reaction. I just jumped a discussion with someone who refused to take my experience and knowledge seriously. But like I stated, it really doesn’t matter. These discussions have no bearing on real life.