D&D General Transgender Drow are Canon in Forgotten Realms! Woo!

While I agree with you general statement, the tweet in question was from Ed himself. He, presumably, is familiar with his contract! Also, he confirms this rumor, but I have never heard of him conferming the "on Realms book per year" rumor.
Here's the thing, though: it's not a contract. It is, according to that tweet, something in the "original Realms agreement." Presumably that means the purchase agreement for TSR buying the IP rights to the Forgotten Realms. In which case, even if there's a clause which means exactly what Greenwood says it means (which isn't to say he's a liar; people get the specifics of legal agreements wrong all the time), then the validity of it is still in doubt simply because it's not something WotC has to acknowledge or honor. The purchase of the rights won't be invalidated if they somehow come out and say "no, whatever Ed Greenwood writes is not inherently canon, regardless of whether or not we contradict it in a published product."

Of course, a lot of this concerns the nature of what "canon" is (and why so many fans consider it important), but that's a separate discussion.
 
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Here's the thing, though: it's not a contract. It is, according to that tweet, something in the "original Realms agreement." Presumably that means the purchase agreement for TSR buying the IP rights to the Forgotten Realms. In which case, even if there's a clause which means exactly what Greenwood says it means (which isn't to say he's a liar; people get the specifics of legal agreements wrong all the time), then the validity of it is still in doubt simply because it's not something WotC has to acknowledge or honor. The purchase of the rights won't be invalidated if they somehow come out and say "no, whatever Ed Greenwood writes is not inherently canon, regardless of whether or not we contradict it in a published product."

Of course, a lot of this concerns the nature of what "canon" is (and why so many fans consider it important), but that's a separate discussion.
So... here's a thing I learned in Real Estate:

When you sell something, you can sell it conditionally, and you can sell it piecemeal.

If I own a home I can sell the prospecting rights under the house without selling the home. I can sell the airspace rights above it without selling the home. And I can sell off portions of the property as small as 1 square foot without selling the home. Ostensibly, I could also sell specific rooms of the house while retaining use rights to the rest of the house, up to and including ingress/egress easements. I could even sell every part of the house except for one bedroom, and use an ingress-egress easement to pass through the parts of the house I don't own on my way in and out of the house.

And I can retain rights for conditionality purposes. Such as selling my home at a -distinctly- lower price than other homes in the area to provide it to a halfway house program or for church use or other options, while retaining the exclusive legal right to drink alcohol on the property. And if someone in that halfway house or church property drinks booze on the premises, I can reclaim the entire property while keeping the money.

Granted. IP rights aren't exactly real estate rights. But. We see some of those same functions showing up in Hollywood Movies, too. For example the Fantastic Four's film rights were owned by Constantin Films after they bought them in 1986.

And in order to try and retain the rights for longer, they produced a really crappy low-budget Fantastic 4 movie with paid actors and crew that was never commercially released. It worked. Because the contract said they had to MAKE a Fantastic 4 film, not distribute it.

Why did they have to make the trash version? Bernd Eichinger bought the rights in order to do a large scale production of the Fantastic 4, but securing funding, finding a decent script, and the like took longer than anticipated and the rights were about to revert.

He'd later go on and make the 2005 Fantastic 4 film by sublicensing to Fox Searchlight in order to get the funding needed. And then when the rights were about to revert, AGAIN, Bernd did the 2015 version.

Constantin Films bought the rights on the condition that they made a film within 10 years. So every 10 years or so (1994, 2005, 2015, 2025) there's been another movie. Disney purchased Fox Studios, and the Sublicensed rights in the process. And bought out Constantin's rights to produce Fantastic 4 movies along the way. So we'll definitely see another Fantastic 4 film post-First Steps by 2035. And every 10 years after that, too, just so Disney retains the rights.

So it's not ENTIRELY out of the question that he 'Retained Rights' to continue to make authoritative statements about the canon of the Forgotten Realms until such time as he is directly contradicted by TSR. And since WotC can only buy the rights that TSR possesses, they cannot buy the right he retained.

I think he knows the purchase agreement better than we do, though.
 

Alternatively: People can be transgender without physical modification.
That was the approach the culture in Taladas as taking - no potions or magic or anything, just live/dress/act like other gender and you're accepted as it.

That said I do think if any kind of magic/alchemy at all existed that let people transition physically, there would be people finding and utilizing it. And if it didn't exist, someone would probably learn magic and become a powerful mage in order to develop a spell to do that! (though whether they were civic-minded enough to spread the spell to others would depend very much on their personality and experiences).
So... here's a thing I learned in Real Estate:

When you sell something, you can sell it conditionally, and you can sell it piecemeal.

If I own a home I can sell the prospecting rights under the house without selling the home. I can sell the airspace rights above it without selling the home. And I can sell off portions of the property as small as 1 square foot without selling the home. Ostensibly, I could also sell specific rooms of the house while retaining use rights to the rest of the house, up to and including ingress/egress easements. I could even sell every part of the house except for one bedroom, and use an ingress-egress easement to pass through the parts of the house I don't own on my way in and out of the house.

And I can retain rights for conditionality purposes. Such as selling my home at a -distinctly- lower price than other homes in the area to provide it to a halfway house program or for church use or other options, while retaining the exclusive legal right to drink alcohol on the property. And if someone in that halfway house or church property drinks booze on the premises, I can reclaim the entire property while keeping the money.

Granted. IP rights aren't exactly real estate rights. But. We see some of those same functions showing up in Hollywood Movies, too. For example the Fantastic Four's film rights were owned by Constantin Films after they bought them in 1986.

And in order to try and retain the rights for longer, they produced a really crappy low-budget Fantastic 4 movie with paid actors and crew that was never commercially released. It worked. Because the contract said they had to MAKE a Fantastic 4 film, not distribute it.

Why did they have to make the trash version? Bernd Eichinger bought the rights in order to do a large scale production of the Fantastic 4, but securing funding, finding a decent script, and the like took longer than anticipated and the rights were about to revert.

He'd later go on and make the 2005 Fantastic 4 film by sublicensing to Fox Searchlight in order to get the funding needed. And then when the rights were about to revert, AGAIN, Bernd did the 2015 version.

Constantin Films bought the rights on the condition that they made a film within 10 years. So every 10 years or so (1994, 2005, 2015, 2025) there's been another movie. Disney purchased Fox Studios, and the Sublicensed rights in the process. And bought out Constantin's rights to produce Fantastic 4 movies along the way. So we'll definitely see another Fantastic 4 film post-First Steps by 2035. And every 10 years after that, too, just so Disney retains the rights.

So it's not ENTIRELY out of the question that he 'Retained Rights' to continue to make authoritative statements about the canon of the Forgotten Realms until such time as he is directly contradicted by TSR. And since WotC can only buy the rights that TSR possesses, they cannot buy the right he retained.

I think he knows the purchase agreement better than we do, though.
Fascinating on multiple levels, I didn't know about a lot of this - I mean I knew this guy owned the FF rights but I didn't realize there was this 10 years clause.
 

So... here's a thing I learned in Real Estate:

When you sell something, you can sell it conditionally, and you can sell it piecemeal.

If I own a home I can sell the prospecting rights under the house without selling the home. I can sell the airspace rights above it without selling the home. And I can sell off portions of the property as small as 1 square foot without selling the home. Ostensibly, I could also sell specific rooms of the house while retaining use rights to the rest of the house, up to and including ingress/egress easements. I could even sell every part of the house except for one bedroom, and use an ingress-egress easement to pass through the parts of the house I don't own on my way in and out of the house.

And I can retain rights for conditionality purposes. Such as selling my home at a -distinctly- lower price than other homes in the area to provide it to a halfway house program or for church use or other options, while retaining the exclusive legal right to drink alcohol on the property. And if someone in that halfway house or church property drinks booze on the premises, I can reclaim the entire property while keeping the money.

Granted. IP rights aren't exactly real estate rights. But. We see some of those same functions showing up in Hollywood Movies, too. For example the Fantastic Four's film rights were owned by Constantin Films after they bought them in 1986.

And in order to try and retain the rights for longer, they produced a really crappy low-budget Fantastic 4 movie with paid actors and crew that was never commercially released. It worked. Because the contract said they had to MAKE a Fantastic 4 film, not distribute it.

Why did they have to make the trash version? Bernd Eichinger bought the rights in order to do a large scale production of the Fantastic 4, but securing funding, finding a decent script, and the like took longer than anticipated and the rights were about to revert.

He'd later go on and make the 2005 Fantastic 4 film by sublicensing to Fox Searchlight in order to get the funding needed. And then when the rights were about to revert, AGAIN, Bernd did the 2015 version.

Constantin Films bought the rights on the condition that they made a film within 10 years. So every 10 years or so (1994, 2005, 2015, 2025) there's been another movie. Disney purchased Fox Studios, and the Sublicensed rights in the process. And bought out Constantin's rights to produce Fantastic 4 movies along the way. So we'll definitely see another Fantastic 4 film post-First Steps by 2035. And every 10 years after that, too, just so Disney retains the rights.

So it's not ENTIRELY out of the question that he 'Retained Rights' to continue to make authoritative statements about the canon of the Forgotten Realms until such time as he is directly contradicted by TSR. And since WotC can only buy the rights that TSR possesses, they cannot buy the right he retained.

I think he knows the purchase agreement better than we do, though.
The thing about movie rights being conditional on films being produced after so many years is fairly standard in the film industry today. It's why War of the Rohirrim was made at all, and as I recall it was also a fairly significant part around the legal battle to regain the D&D film rights.

But short of confirming that such things exist in another industry, I don't think that tells us anything about the purchase agreement of the Forgotten Realms. (What I find more salient is that, when Peter Adkison purchased TSR, he made sure to go around and clean up troublesome legal agreements surrounding D&D, the big one being writing Dave Arneson a large check so they could call it "Dungeons & Dragons" instead of "Advanced Dungeons & Dragons" and not have to pay Arneson royalties for doing so; I doubt any such provision with Greenwood would have slipped Adkison's mind.)
 

But short of confirming that such things exist in another industry, I don't think that tells us anything about the purchase agreement of the Forgotten Realms. (What I find more salient is that, when Peter Adkison purchased TSR, he made sure to go around and clean up troublesome legal agreements surrounding D&D, the big one being writing Dave Arneson a large check so they could call it "Dungeons & Dragons" instead of "Advanced Dungeons & Dragons" and not have to pay Arneson royalties for doing so; I doubt any such provision with Greenwood would have slipped Adkison's mind.)
I wouldn't bet on it. Adkison wasn't exactly a business genius. Plus, the purported contract doesn't exactly hinder Wizards in any way. Being able to call the game Dungeons & Dragons, without the "Advanced", is on the other hand a huge marketing advantage.

My understanding of Adkison's cleaning up was also that it was about mending fences. Greenwood seems pretty happy with his end of the bargain, so there's no reason for him to renegotiate.
 

The thing about movie rights being conditional on films being produced after so many years is fairly standard in the film industry today. It's why War of the Rohirrim was made at all, and as I recall it was also a fairly significant part around the legal battle to regain the D&D film rights.

But short of confirming that such things exist in another industry, I don't think that tells us anything about the purchase agreement of the Forgotten Realms. (What I find more salient is that, when Peter Adkison purchased TSR, he made sure to go around and clean up troublesome legal agreements surrounding D&D, the big one being writing Dave Arneson a large check so they could call it "Dungeons & Dragons" instead of "Advanced Dungeons & Dragons" and not have to pay Arneson royalties for doing so; I doubt any such provision with Greenwood would have slipped Adkison's mind.)
Oh, I don't imagine anything slipped his mind.

It just becomes a multipart equation:

1) How much, if any amount, will Ed Greenwood demand for that right to be purchased?
2) How much, if any amount, is WotC willing to spend for that right to be purchased?
3) How important is the Forgotten Realms and it's history as being one of the best selling products of 2e to WotC?
4) How much, if any amount, does WotC care if some old guy writes 'Canon Faerun' on his internet blog when they already have the rights to ignore and override literally anything he says in the purchase agreement they already possess?

Add that all up and you get a WotC spokesperson saying "Everything that happens at your table is canon to your version of the Forgotten Realms and that's valid." rather than giving Greenwood an additional penny.
 

I wouldn't bet on it. Adkison wasn't exactly a business genius. Plus, the purported contract doesn't exactly hinder Wizards in any way. Being able to call the game Dungeons & Dragons, without the "Advanced", is on the other hand a huge marketing advantage.

My understanding of Adkison's cleaning up was also that it was about mending fences. Greenwood seems pretty happy with his end of the bargain, so there's no reason for him to renegotiate.
You misunderstood my meaning; I was saying that if we're going to look at completely different circumstances (i.e. film rights) as being instructive with regard to what may or may not be in the purchase agreement of the Forgotten Realms, then we should perhaps look a little closer to home.
Oh, I don't imagine anything slipped his mind.

It just becomes a multipart equation:

1) How much, if any amount, will Ed Greenwood demand for that right to be purchased?
2) How much, if any amount, is WotC willing to spend for that right to be purchased?
3) How important is the Forgotten Realms and it's history as being one of the best selling products of 2e to WotC?
4) How much, if any amount, does WotC care if some old guy writes 'Canon Faerun' on his internet blog when they already have the rights to ignore and override literally anything he says in the purchase agreement they already possess?

Add that all up and you get a WotC spokesperson saying "Everything that happens at your table is canon to your version of the Forgotten Realms and that's valid." rather than giving Greenwood an additional penny.
The problem with #4 is that it presumes an awful lot about what "canon" even is, which is why I'm still skeptical about the entire thing. How is "canon" defined in that agreement, for instance? Or is it defined at all? Without salient details, things like Greenwood's tweet don't strike me as meaning what a lot of people seem to think it means.
 

The problem with #4 is that it presumes an awful lot about what "canon" even is, which is why I'm still skeptical about the entire thing. How is "canon" defined in that agreement, for instance? Or is it defined at all? Without salient details, things like Greenwood's tweet don't strike me as meaning what a lot of people seem to think it means.
Ask Ed?

He clearly has no problem answering questions online. Maybe he'll even upload a scan of the contract...

No guarantees, obviously.

Point is: He made a claim. And based on what I know about selling rights to property, whether Real Estate or Intellectual, it's a sound claim.
 

Ask Ed?

He clearly has no problem answering questions online. Maybe he'll even upload a scan of the contract...

No guarantees, obviously.

Point is: He made a claim. And based on what I know about selling rights to property, whether Real Estate or Intellectual, it's a sound claim.
I'm not on social media (excepting this board; do messageboards count as social media?), and while I'd like him to post the full text of the purchase agreement (since I think that'd be the quickest way to settle this issue), I think it'd be rather gauche to ask him (or anyone) to do that simply to satisfy my curiosity.

Likewise, I also have some knowledge about selling rights, and I find the claim to be...not so much "less than sound" as "ill-defined."
 

Historically, there were a -ton- of trans and gender nonconforming people recognized in Mesopotamia...

...Similarly, in the Western Semitic traditions all the way up 'til the early 100s CE, there were -six- recognized genders. Zachar or man, Nekevah or woman, Androgynos who possessed traits of both, Tumtum who lacked sexual characteristics, Aylonit who were called girl at birth and aylonit as adults, and Saris who were born boys and became saris as adults.

Technically eight. As there were Aylonit and Saris Adam and Aylonit and Saris Hamah. Adam in this case being "By human hand" and Hamah being "By divine hand".

...So even in Abrahamic cultures there are different gender constructs. It's mostly the Romans who spread the "Only Two" thing through their various conquests....

...So yeah. Lots of historical evidence of much older cultures dealing with and accepting people existing as the gender or sex they espoused rather than trying to force them into two boxes. It's really just that Latin dominated other cultures and lacked much in the way of language to communicate such important ideas, even though the cultures the Romans conquered possessed words to describe those things and continued to observe those traditions beyond the conquests.

One doesn't even have to reach that distantly to find curious slippages in traditional society:

In ye olde Renaissance, much less distant from the medieval period elf-games tend to prize, we had young men, portraying women, who disguise themselves as men (Two Gentlemen of Verona, As You Like It).

My goodness, such an uproar.
 

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