Ravenloft: The Horrors Within Announced, Release Date Scheduled for June 2026

[Paul Farquhar]

TO YOU.

Haven’t come across anyone defending them. But the feedback is irrelevant. UA is marketing, not part of the development process. If the WotC developers need a bunch of amateurs to tell them when something isn’t right then they should be looking for a different line of work.

 

[Remathilis]

Haven’t come across anyone defending them. But the feedback is irrelevant. UA is marketing, not part of the development process. If the WotC developers need a bunch of amateurs to tell them when something isn’t right then they should be looking for a different line of work.

UA is a vibes check. The problem is that no one knows what the vibes are unless WotC tells us. Everyone can point to times when the audience deep sixed an idea (purple dragon knight) and then can point to examples where the community was absolutely certain something would never see the light of day and it passed the vibes check anyway (Twilight cleric). The problem is that this hobby is full of amateur "disgraced professional game developers" who think they understand D&D better than anyone (especially WotC) and loudly proclaim they know what's best/how to fix D&D.

My point is if you look at a bunch of polemics on Enworld and Reddit as the voices for the community because they don't like a UA as proof of it's failure, you're deluding yourself that a vocal minority speaks for the greater majority.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

My point is if you look at a bunch of polemics on Enworld and Reddit

I don’t. I can see for myself when something is well off target, and I like to think the people who work at WotC are at least as capable of that as I am.

Sure, it’s not impossible that WotC put out a steaming pile of garbage, but their track record hasn’t been bad of late.

UA is a vibes check

And the vibe the were checking was “hey, we are working on Dark Sun, who is excited?” I don’t believe that particular effort was ever intended as more than marketing.

 

[Remathilis]

I don’t. I can see for myself when something is well off target, and I like to think the people who work at WotC are at least as capable of that as I am.

I'm sure they are moreso. And I feel it useful yet again that we are not always given the full picture. People screamed and cried about Purple Dragon Knights having purple dragons, bemoaned the betrayal of The Sacred Texts (aka some obscure 2e sourcebook) and threw all their toys out of the pram over it.

And what did we get? The same lore we were always going to get, purple dragon riders and all, except we got a mediocre warlord subclass instead.

I'm sure that preserving and defiling were not just tied to two subclasses. But unfortunately that's all they gave us and thus everyone judged it as if that was the word and the law. If there is anything I hate about how WotC does UA, it's that they don't give enough context to judge the mechanics by. On the other hand, they aren't play testing the idea Cormyrs knights becoming a world spanning dragon riding army, they are saying "hey is that fun to play or no?"

Sure, it’s not impossible that WotC put out a steaming pile of garbage, but their track record hasn’t been bad of late.

Potent dragonmark says hi. As does banneret from the other side of Hell.

 

[Parmandur]

I don’t. I can see for myself when something is well off target, and I like to think the people who work at WotC are at least as capable of that as I am.

Sure, it’s not impossible that WotC put out a steaming pile of garbage, but their track record hasn’t been bad of late.

And the vibe the were checking was “hey, we are working on Dark Sun, who is excited?” I don’t believe that particular effort was ever intended as more than marketing.

Well, no, the vibe check is if people don't like an option...they won't publish it.

It prevents stuff like Incarnum from seeing print, not fiddley details on design.

 

[Remathilis]

Well, no, the vibe check is if people don't like an option...they won't publish it.

I kinda feel the opposite now. UA is a taste test and they want to know if the soup needs more garlic, not whether or not we want soup or pizza. I don't, for example, really think that they would abandon the psion again, but even if it has low-balled beyond salvagabilty, I don't think we would have DS shelved until they made mystic 2.0. Books are on deadlines and art and page design are finite resources. At a certain point, I think they either salvage what they can or go forward regardless.

 

[Kurotowa]

I kinda feel the opposite now. UA is a taste test and they want to know if the soup needs more garlic, not whether or not we want soup or pizza. I don't, for example, really think that they would abandon the psion again, but even if it has low-balled beyond salvagabilty, I don't think we would have DS shelved until they made mystic 2.0. Books are on deadlines and art and page design are finite resources. At a certain point, I think they either salvage what they can or go forward regardless.

Indeed. To put it simply, UA isn't open source game design. It's market research. Which has more impact on the final release than just being early promotional material, but less impact than when they're soliciting specific design feedback from trusted play testers.

 

[Parmandur]

Indeed. To put it simply, UA isn't open source game design. It's market research. Which has more impact on the final release than just being early promotional material, but less impact than when they're soliciting specific design feedback from trusted play testers.

That level of market research is definitely one of D&D structural advantages.

 

[mamba]

That level of market research is definitely one of D&D structural advantages.

it could be, but their unclear multiple choice options did not do them any favors during the 5.5 UAs.

Supposedly they are better now, but I decided to not bother with their UAs (not a loss for them, just saying I am not sure what the multiple choice looks like now)

 

[Remathilis]

it could be, but their unclear multiple choice options did not do them any favors during the 5.5 UAs.

Supposedly they are better now, but I decided to not bother with their UAs (not a loss for them, just saying I am not sure what the multiple choice looks like now)

It's a stoplight. Red means no. Green means yes. Yellow means yes, but...