D&D 5E (2014) So 5E is the Successor to AD&D 2nd Edition? How and How Not?

[Cergorach]

So 5E is the Successor to AD&D 2nd Edition?

I would say it isn't the direct successor, 3e was. But 5e incorporates a LOT from all the previous incarnations, including what NOT to do (I'm looking at you 4e!)...

I started D&D with the old Red Box (in Dutch) and quickly moved over to AD&D2e when it came out, we played it for a LONG time and it has a nostalgic place in my memories. But we saw many of the advantages of 3e and started playing it even before it was released (due to Eric Noah's rumour compilations), moved nicely into 3.5e and skipped 4e (I tried but couldn't get myself into it), played a bit of 5e when it came out. Took a break and started again a couple of years ago and moved into 5e 2024.

That said, I recently dove into Dark Sun to run a one-shot under 5e 2024 at some future date. For me Dark Sun is the original DS Boxed set for 2e and the products that came with it, the revised boxed set a lot less so. So when I dove heavily into the old AD&D 2e DS rules booklet from the boxed set, things that I had long 'forgotten' surfaced about 2e. Things like only certain races could play certain classes, minimum stats for classes, limited dual/multiclass combinations based on race, bonus XP for high stats, different XP tracks for different classes, etc. The less cool things about old AD&D 2e that are no longer relevant today and haven't been for over a quarter of a century in D&D...

I wonder if that's me looking at AD&D2e through rose colored glasses (nostalgia) at something I liked at the time. Or are these unimportant game mechanics I have forgotten due to disuse after a quarter of a century? For me 5e isn't perfect either (no D&D version really is), but I suspect 5e 2024 is closer to perfection then the previous incarnation, at least for me and my group...

 

[ZeshinX]

I don't find 5e to be a successor to 2e as much as it is it's own, evolved thing which has elements that came from 2e (and 3e with a sprinkling of 4e).

One aspect I do miss is a loss of hindrances or negative consequences. I don't mean to suggest I miss truly un-fun or overly punitive downsides, but there isn't much in the way of overall consequence. It feels like nerf D&D. No rough edges, everything is safe, you can pick what you like, play what you like and the game is designed to reward you no matter what. Even character death is "soft".

I miss choices having consequence. For example, weapon mastery rules...if you don't like your picks, no worries, change them on the next short/long rest. Just....no. Pick your masteries as you wish, absolutely...but once chosen, they stick. Now as you play, if you start to feel they just aren't as fun as you had hoped, or find you just don't like them, okay, but you're going to need to spend time re-training, far more than a short/long rest. Until then, you need to stick with them.

I'm also disliking the way spells known/prepared/spell slots are becoming so completely homogenized among the classes with no real consequence when it comes to at least preparing spells. That's not to say full casters aren't still distinct, they certainly are...but I found them more interesting and fun when their casting architecture was a little different from one another. I do understand it makes the game much easier to learn this way, but I feel it contributes to a loss of flair and flavour (a personal preference of a highly subjective nature of course).

Overall I find 5e is a lot of fun and definitely enjoy it, but I do also feel the game has lost a sense of meaningful consequence (and the challenge that accompanies either learning ways to overcome or adapt to those consequences).

 

[Sacrosanct]

Personally I think AD&D 1E was better than 2nd edition. I do think 5E is the best of all the editions and if I had to rank them it would be:

1. 5E
2. AD&D 1E
3. AD&D 2E
4. BX
5. 3E
6-98: Any other RPG or D&D clone
99. 4E

I think 5E has the feel of 1E in a lot of ways but with better, easier to understand rules. I also think while "bounded accuracy" did not exist as a term in 1E/2E it was there in play IMO. A Kobold lair could wipe out a party of 15th level players in 1E if things went sideways. 3E is what brought about the ladder you had to stay on to be competitive and what made monsters like Kobolds essentially useless against high level characters.

I get what you are saying about the other stuff - healing, healing word, mummy rot, Wights/Wraiths/Vampires .... and I do agree that makes play a lot different than 1E or 2E. 1E and 2E were just more dangerous and difficult but the feel is largely the same. I think that caters to a new audience that wants an easier time. But in terms of feel I do think 5E is closer to those two than to other editions or than they are to other editions.

1E had better vibes. 2E was cleaned up a bit to much.

Try playing either with 2026 players. 2Es a lot better to learn.

I like 2E personally but B/X is really good still AD&D has aged badly.

Necro'd thread, but whatevs, I'll reply to the recent posts

One of the best things about 1e/2e is that they were intentionally built to be compatible, which allowed us to mix and match the best parts of each edition to our tastes. Hard to do with later editions. For example, I love how 1e is presented and the art, but it was also easy for me to incorporate 2e changes like spell spheres, thief/bard skill progression, etc.

Funny enough I'm currently working on a 2e clone that pulls some things from 1e. Lots of 1e clones, only 1 2e clone, and no offense to Gold and Glory*, but the presentation and layout has some challenges, like walls of text. The primary purpose of what I'm doing is to present it in a more user-friendly format, especially for us who are getting older, like 13 pt font, rearranging things to have everything you need in one place instead of flipping back and forth between books, summarizing parts, etc.

* I think Justen and team deserve a lot of credit, and they crammed 3 books into one and had to keep age count down, and a drawback of that is a ton of smaller font text on one page. My comment isn't meant to take a dig at them.

 

[Retreater]

I've been thinking about this since making the original post over a year ago. Also, I was looking through my phone's photos recently and found where I took a picture of the three core "2024" books I had just purchased - it was dated June 29, 2025. I've had the new edition of D&D for almost a year, and I think I've cracked open the books once. This has never happened - not even during 4E.

So what's keeping me from playing it?
I don't want to switch my existing 5E games to it to "force" players to buy new stuff or learn new mechanics. But in truth, I'm running exactly one 5E game, playing a casual 2-hour session around once a month. When I'm looking at starting a new regular campaign, I don't even consider 5E (or 5.5E).

My last attempt at running (and also again as a player) 5E was Level Up. It did a lot to sour me on the experience. I know it's an EN Publishing product, and I should be praising it, but I didn't enjoy it. It crossed whatever line of demarcation I have into "too bloated" territory. It certainly didn't help me enjoy 5E more. Same thing with MCDM's Flee Mortals.

I'm finding myself missing "D&D" and it's 50+ years of history: classes, spells, monsters, magic items, lore, ancestries, etc. I've been running two weekly Daggerheart campaigns for almost a year, and I feel like I've exhausted it. I've seen practically every monster, power, combination of classes and power sources. I don't want the bloat of 5.5, Level Up, Pathfinder, 3rd edition, or 4E. Maybe 2E could be that sweet spot?

 

[Retreater]

Funny enough I'm currently working on a 2e clone that pulls some things from 1e. Lots of 1e clones, only 1 2e clone, and no offense to Gold and Glory*, but the presentation and layout has some challenges, like walls of text. The primary purpose of what I'm doing is to present it in a more user-friendly format, especially for us who are getting older, like 13 pt font, rearranging things to have everything you need in one place instead of flipping back and forth between books, summarizing parts, etc.

Thank you for doing this! Can't wait to see what you come up with.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Thank you for doing this! Can't wait to see what you come up with.

An example from the Paladin entry (this isn't final, and hasn't been edited yet, so ignore any spelling issues or things like that for now).

 

[payn]

I've been thinking about this since making the original post over a year ago. Also, I was looking through my phone's photos recently and found where I took a picture of the three core "2024" books I had just purchased - it was dated June 29, 2025. I've had the new edition of D&D for almost a year, and I think I've cracked open the books once. This has never happened - not even during 4E.

So what's keeping me from playing it?
I don't want to switch my existing 5E games to it to "force" players to buy new stuff or learn new mechanics. But in truth, I'm running exactly one 5E game, playing a casual 2-hour session around once a month. When I'm looking at starting a new regular campaign, I don't even consider 5E (or 5.5E).

My last attempt at running (and also again as a player) 5E was Level Up. It did a lot to sour me on the experience. I know it's an EN Publishing product, and I should be praising it, but I didn't enjoy it. It crossed whatever line of demarcation I have into "too bloated" territory. It certainly didn't help me enjoy 5E more. Same thing with MCDM's Flee Mortals.

I'm finding myself missing "D&D" and it's 50+ years of history: classes, spells, monsters, magic items, lore, ancestries, etc. I've been running two weekly Daggerheart campaigns for almost a year, and I feel like I've exhausted it. I've seen practically every monster, power, combination of classes and power sources. I don't want the bloat of 5.5, Level Up, Pathfinder, 3rd edition, or 4E. Maybe 2E could be that sweet spot?

It sounds like you are a system hopper. You are intrigued by new options, but either you explore them out and tire of the system, or find its all too much to bother with. Then, your second issue is you are interested in D&D IP beyond the system. You just like D&D stuff.

Id say you need to bust one or the other. Either pick a D&D edition and stick with it, or cut the tie on D&D stuff and just enjoy the system hopping journey wherever it takes you.

 

[TwoSix]

An example from the Paladin entry (this isn't final, and hasn't been edited yet, so ignore any spelling issues or things like that for now).

View attachment 433835
View attachment 433836
View attachment 433837
View attachment 433838
View attachment 433839

Very intriguing. I'm assuming it's meant to be a straight clone as much as possible? Are you integrating later material into the text? (Like Complete X Handbook material, or Player's Option material?)

 

[Sacrosanct]

Very intriguing. I'm assuming it's meant to be a straight clone as much as possible? Are you integrating later material into the text? (Like Complete X Handbook material, or Player's Option material?)

Not a straight clone. Mostly 2e with some 1e elements pulled in, like the assassin and monk classes. And level titles. And each class having their own XP table rather than groups. That last images is a kit page, so there will be some items from the Complete book series, but not nearly as extensive. Trying to keep page count down, so just a couple kits to give the idea.

 

[Desdichado]

I would say it isn't the direct successor, 3e was. But 5e incorporates a LOT from all the previous incarnations, including what NOT to do (I'm looking at you 4e!)...

3e was a direct successor to 2e, but mechanically it was a new thing, and "spiritually" it was probably more a successor to 1e. 5e seems like mechanically it's a successor to 3e, with some of the ideas of 4e rebranded, but I guess I can see that maybe it's a spiritual successor to 2e, at least maybe when it launched. But that's a harder thing to demonstrate, and it much more about "feel" and subjectiveness. And I think from a marketing standpoint, they've certainly migrated more into a later 3e style release schedule, where they're hoping to sell more player-facing books, so the game itself has become more player-facing and player-focused rather than DM-facing and DM-focused.

The OGL debacle certainly feels like TSR's draconian C&D online approach during late 2e, and WotC's 4e approach, which felt much less open and customer friendly, but that's not an aspect of either of those editions that they should want to emulate.