How do Saga skills work?

[Tinker Gnome]

Well, I have heard that Saga is sort of a preview for 4E. My question is, how exactly do skills in Saga work? I heard it was something like 1/2 level + ability modifier+Something else?

 

[Karl Green]

All skills have a base ‘bonus’ of ½ the characters total level, round down + the controlling Attribute modifier (Dex for Acrobatics, Int for Knowledge, etc). Trained skills add +5 to the roll.

You get so many 'Trained' skill depending on your class, intelligence modifier and maybe race (Human get +1 trained skill). You can also get the Feat Skill Training to have another Trained skill. If you Int modifier goes up you get another Trained skill.

The feat Skill Focus adds another +5 to the Skill roll, but can only be taken with skills that are already ‘trained’.

 

[Nine Hands]

Well, I have heard that Saga is sort of a preview for 4E. My question is, how exactly do skills in Saga work? I heard it was something like 1/2 level + ability modifier+Something else?

To make a skill check, roll:

1d20 + one-half your character level + key ability modifier + miscellaneous modifiers.

If you are trained in the skill, add +5 to the skill check result.

Skill focus may be taken with any trained skill and gives an additional +5 bonus.

Skills sometimes have a uses that only a trained person can use.

 

[Tinker Gnome]

Okay, thanks you two!

 

[Remathilis]

Its worth noting:

NOTHING* else grants you a permanent bonus to skill checks. Not race, not synergy, not feats (beyond Skill Focus). Nothing.

Most races show skill aptitude with re-rolls, take-10s, or auto-skill focus.

DCs start high, but most skills fall into a 5-15+ ability mod range (rather than D&Ds 4-23 range). So skills become easier to use, but slower than a 3.5's character would.

Most skills can be used untrained. The sole exception is mechanics (which is completely trained). Most skills have trained-only uses (tumbling for acrobatics, surgery for treat injury) making being trained a very important element beyond the +5.

* Ok, some equipment does, but thats HARDLY a permanent thing...

 

[Tinker Gnome]

Its worth noting:

NOTHING* else grants you a permanent bonus to skill checks. Not race, not synergy, not feats (beyond Skill Focus). Nothing.

Most races show skill aptitude with re-rolls, take-10s, or auto-skill focus.

DCs start high, but most skills fall into a 5-15+ ability mod range (rather than D&Ds 4-23 range). So skills become easier to use, but slower than a 3.5's character would.

Most skills can be used untrained. The sole exception is mechanics (which is completely trained). Most skills have trained-only uses (tumbling for acrobatics, surgery for treat injury) making being trained a very important element beyond the +5.

* Ok, some equipment does, but thats HARDLY a permanent thing...

It still does not sounds too bad. I mean, say a 1st level Human has Knowledge(Arcana) as a trained skill, and he took the Skill Focus feat in it and he has a +3 int mod. He would have a +14 to his knowledge check which is pretty good for 1st level. I know this is using 3.X terms, but the system does not seem so bad from what I have heard of it.

 

[Felon]

It still does not sounds too bad. I mean, say a 1st level Human has Knowledge(Arcana) as a trained skill, and he took the Skill Focus feat in it and he has a +3 int mod. He would have a +14 to his knowledge check which is pretty good for 1st level.

Indeed, if anything you illustrate a converse issue with Saga skills. The average DC still hovers around 15, yet a character can rack up very large entry-level bonuses.

Another issue to note is that there is no such thing as a cross-class skill. If a skill does not appear on your class skill list, you cannot train it. If a scout wants to be trained in Treat Injury, he needs a level of Noble or Soldier.

 

[Wolv0rine]

Indeed, if anything you illustrate a converse issue with Saga skills. The average DC still hovers around 15, yet a character can rack up very large entry-level bonuses.

Another issue to note is that there is no such thing as a cross-class skill. If a skill does not appear on your class skill list, you cannot train it. If a scout wants to be trained in Treat Injury, he needs a level of Noble or Soldier.

While I dislike this system greatly, that part of it right there has soured me on it 110%. If this is even a shadow of the 4E skill system, I foresee writing a new skill system in my future.
Man... I hate when you know you'll have to house-rule something from the ground up before the product even comes out.

 

[Chris_Nightwing]

Man... I hate when you know you'll have to house-rule something from the ground up before the product even comes out.

Man, I hate when you have psychic powers that mean you know that you'll have to house-rule an as yet unseen system..

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

Indeed, if anything you illustrate a converse issue with Saga skills. The average DC still hovers around 15, yet a character can rack up very large entry-level bonuses.

Yeah. But I don't think that's as much a mistake as it is a part of the design. Some people don't like it, and that's understandable. It's part of the philosophy of the game; heroes are super-exceptional and damn good at what they do. Against the average mook in the galaxy, one-on-one they'll win every time. Also, skills scale at half the rate defenses do, so by mid levels Skills vs. Defenses can get to be pretty tough rolls.