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Infinite Crisis - The Aftermath

WayneLigon

Adventurer
[I'll add some links to this when we get the advanced editing box back]

Well, IC is done and behind us. I liked it well enough, but I'm also sort of cool towards it as well. So far, I see no real substantive changes or rather, changes that could not have been handled differently. Probably the hype, and the knowledge that all this has been in the planning stages since before Graduation Day just bums me out; I expected more. I was really rah-rah about it even hafl-way through because I expected more change than I got.

Perhaps more will be revealed in 52, but what has really, really changed? With the Crisis on Infinite Earths and Zero Hour, we got new cities, the very landscape changed, we had a new Legion.. all sorts of things happened down the road. I expected multiple earths again, or whole new worlds that would resonate with this one; Elseworlds that we could regularly access. Maybe it was the weird way they handled the One Year Later releases, starting them in March when the main IC series (and specials) would not end for at least two months past that.

There were things that changed, but not much that really mattered to me. Honestly, I was more concerned that El Diablo was going to buy it. (Thankfully, he did not; he'd best appear in Blue Beetle, given their physical proximity).

The thing that probably pisses me off the most is Superboy's death. There is no reason for it. When the Flash died, he died doing something great and lasting. Supergirl.. I forget, I could have cared less that she died.

What really struck me was how disproportionately the younger heroes of the DCU were affected by this. Superboy dead, Changeling in limbo (proibably reduced to guest appearances), Pantha dead, Risk maimed, Air Wave possibly dead, Bart depowered (for how long, we don't yet know), Tempest missing, Damage badly damaged (though Jones says he has 'big plans' for him; I'm currently betting he's Supernova - I'm also betting that the reason he has that full-head mask is that he's horribly disfigured, which to my mind: better off dead), Cap Marvel Junior changed in some significant way that pretty much just ruins him as a teen character, etc.

I guess what really ticks me about it, though, is that there are some many others they could have used. Superboy was just becoming interesting again! He was shedding the self-doubt he had in the wake of the Luthor takeover and was ready to get back in the game. He was Robin's best friend. He was going places. Now, I have no doubt that he'll be back in some way, shape, form or fashion, but I don't want to wait 10-15 years for it again.

Who would I have used?

Aquaman. Kill him. He's become a bore and he was going to be replaced anyway. He had his own book, which speaks to a certain level of popularity regardless of how he's thought of. A-level Justice Leaguer, old continuing character.. he'd have been missed but not by me. The Aquaman I liked died years ago.

Hawkman. Someone again with his own book, who they were going to get rid of anyway. B-level Justice Leaguer, and someone with retcon upon retcon piled on them until they're useless. Killing him only makes sense at this time, if only to put him out of his misery.

Zatanna. Not a major player, doesn't have her own book. But the same could be said about Superboy. She was the root cause of Identity Crisis and the metahuman prison breakouts. She should have been captured and executed by the villains.

Those are not significant for you? You want a significant death? You know who I would have used?

Wonder Woman.

She's crossed the line further than Bats has, and her source of her power is leaving the world. She should have gone out in the blaze of glory, being one of the few people that could have fought Superboy-Prime on anything like his own level. They're going to reboot her book anyway, so make Cassie receive her power and become Wonder Woman in her stead. Pass the torch, like was done with the Flash.
 

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Filby

First Post
WayneLigon said:
Damage badly damaged (though Jones says he has 'big plans' for him; I'm currently betting he's Supernova - I'm also betting that the reason he has that full-head mask is that he's horribly disfigured, which to my mind: better off dead)

Personally, I think he'll be the new Human Bomb in the Freedom Fighters.
 

WayneLigon

Adventurer
Filby said:
Personally, I think he'll be the new Human Bomb in the Freedom Fighters.

It has been confirmed that he won't be. It seems likely that one of the people introduced in Battle for Bludhaven will be, though whether he's a member of the real FF or the fake one, I dunno yet.
 

WayneLigon

Adventurer
Taelorn76 said:
Can you give some spoilers as to what the changes were?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Character_changes_during_Infinite_Crisis probably has the most comprehensive list of changes, as well as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Year_Later

Some other things:
Magic has been seriously messed with. It's still not 'right'. I cannot remember if the Tenth Age has begun yet, or not; I thought it would only begin when a new Dr. Fate was incarnated but I forget.

Every metahuman prison on Earth (or prison with a significant metahuman population) was broken open near the end of the Crisis as part of Luthor's plan. Arkham and a couple others were retaken but on the whole, lots of people are now free, especially if they did not participate in the assault on Metropolis.

The Marvel Family appears to have undergone a shakeup. Besides longer capes :) Cap Junior appears to have an adult form now, and the white male is probably what Billy has become, to take the place of Shazam? Dunno. The Trials of Shazam series should have answers.
 

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Klaus

First Post
I think DC is working its way out of the "Captain Marvel (but not Marvel's Captain Marvel)" conundrum, and will change Cap's identity to Shazam (since the character is commonly called that anyway).

Identity Crisis accomplished quite a few things, like:
- Batman is no longer an overacheiving paranoid control-freak, but rather a human being.
- Superman without powers for a year could spell b-a-b-y for the Kent couple. Plus they get to say 'Superman Returns!' in the comics circa June...
- Wonder Woman will probably emerge with a secret identity as Diana Prince, and already has an invisible jet again (as seen in the end of IC#7). Also, there's no longer the 'Hippolyta as DC's first Wonder Woman' thing. Diana is the first.
- I have a strong feeling that the uber-cool Batwoman seen in the end of IC#7 is Barbara Gordon, wearing a costume that mixes her Batgirl costume with the cartoon Batwoman/Batman Beyond costumes.
 

WayneLigon

Adventurer
Klaus said:
I think DC is working its way out of the "Captain Marvel (but not Marvel's Captain Marvel)" conundrum, and will change Cap's identity to Shazam (since the character is commonly called that anyway).

Hmm? Actually, he's never called that since that is (or was) the Wizard's name. The only place he's referred to in that fashion is on covers and in advertising because of that damn copyright thing.

Now, if nothing else, this solves Freddy's big problem of what to call himself, if he's now able to go as 'Captain Marvel'. If that's Freddy in the red-and-gold.
 

stevelabny

Explorer
Gah. I loved a lot of what DC had done over the past few years:

tight continuity (and mostly correct unless your name is Nightwing or Robin)
interesting personalities for ALL their characters (including the usually boring big 3)
actions having consequences
and a feeling of real drama.

I was looking forward to Crisis. I was sure they wouldn't mess it up. It started off very well and I never believed theyd be dumb enough to return to the Multiverse and all the mistakes of their past. Even after years of Marvel and DC doing nothing long changing, I was hoping that something would actually happen in Crisis.

Apparently, I'm a fool.

Dan DiDio and DC didn't just drop the ball, they broke it.

Not only did they not go as extreme as I hoped (killing Batman) or as bad as I feared (the Multiverse) they actually managed to find an ending that was WORSE.

Re-retconning the entire DC Universe is HORRIBLE. You just spent 20 years trying to get people acclimated to the differences between the pre-Crisis and post-Crisis universe. Now you have a pre-Crisis, post-Crisis, and post-Infinite Crisis universe. For what purpose? To decide which Superman origin is legit? To put Joe Chill in jail? To make Diana the one true Wonder Woman and give her the ridiculous invisible plane back? YIKES.

Wonder Woman was the monthly title that benefitted most from the IC buildup storyline, almost doubling in sales, and has now lost all momentum with a 3 month break. Sure a new #1 will get nice sales, but somehow I don't see an civilian idenitity and an invisible plane keeping her interesting the same way being the practical one of the big 3 did.

Flash was the considered one of the most dependable monthly books with long runs by Waid and Johns, and Wally had firmly established himself as one of the most important characters in the DCU. He had been around as long as any of them, and had the respect of the the big 3 and has been on the JLA with all the legends. He grew up with the Titans and is Nightwings best friend. And because he is one of the few sidekicks to "graduate" even the youngest generation of heroes look up to him. EVERYONE loves and respects him. So of coure he is missing.

DC (and Marvel) keep insisiting that you cant change the "iconic" status of certain characters. That marrying them or moving forward is a bad idea. Yet the one character who's entire personality was based on being an impulsive and fun-loving kid, has been aged "a few years" .

So with all the hype of shaking the status-quo, what did we get? Dead Superboy? Dead Earth-2 Superman and Lois? Dead z-listers? Temporarily powerless Clark? And Bruce being back to "normal" as if all of the misdeeds that he's done and that have been done to him never happened and as if he's not human and shouldn't be getting older?

The OYL books are bad too. What Robin is up to in Titans is interesting, but of course might undo what JUST happened in Crisis, and Robin is acting so much darker in Titans than his own book, or his goofy sidekick-of-light representation in Batman and Detective. Most of the OYL books havent changed the status quo very much, and the few that have did it in the most nonsenical ways. Black Canary and Oracle not talking after all the time theyve spent building a relationship in Birds of Prey? That is one story, that if you want to write it, you CANNOT have the "breakup" happen "off camera".

Between the Infinite Crisis Aftermath, and the continuing reign of Quesada at Marvel (where just last week, he commented on how marrying Spider-man to MJ was the worst thing ever) I think it's almost time for me to give up completely and just find something else to read.

And that's sad.
 

Villano

First Post
I was cynical concerning the whole IC thing. It just seemed like a marketing tool. How many mini-series are connected to this thing? Countdown, Rannn-Thanagr War, OMAC, Villains United, Vengeance, 52, and Battle For Bludhaven. There are also a few others like Ion, but I don't know if/how they connect. Did I miss any?

I'll probably pick up the TPB of IC just out of curiosity even though it sounds as if it's done more bad than good (I've read a few reviews of the last issue and only one was positive).

stevelabny said:
The OYL books are bad too.

I've been mostly confused. In some cases, like Catwoman, there's some potential there since Selina just had a child and there's a new woman under the mask. Then there's Green Arrow which is just...stupid.

I'm giving the series just one more issue before I drop it. Nothing makes sense. Okay, part of the city was destroyed and it's deemed too expensive to repair. Fair enough. But they built a giant wall around that part of the city and there are people still inside?! Wha..? How much did that cost? It's taller than the surrounding buildings! You mean it's cheaper to construct a 500 ft tall, many miles long "Great Wall of China" than repair the buildings?

And why are people trapped? Something like this doesn't spring up overnight. I doubt it could even be built in a year (especially in a city that suffered a huge disaster). Hell, where I was living before, they were widening a stretch of highway. Five years later, I moved and they were still working on it!

On top of that, GA is now the mayor (as Oliver Queen, of course). His press conference is just bizarre. It sounds like it was written by a 12 year old trying to sound edgy.

So, why am I giving it one more issue? There's a line in which one of his Mayoral aides says that Ollie really doesn't want the wall down because, if he did, he would have asked Green Lantern or someone like that to tear it down in a day. That's a good point. I'm hoping that there's more to GA's motivation, but I'm afraid it's going to turn out that the heroes he asked refused or that GA feels that it's something he (or the city) need to do themselves.
 
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