Converting monsters from Tales From The Infinite Staircase

freyar said:

I think I'd leave off the Concealing Swarm. And let's just go with CR 1; it's an art, not a science.

Click to expand...

That's OK by me.

Updating Fly Swarm Working Draft.

I think we'd better change the "Temperate plains" to, say, "Any land".

freyar said:

Tactics: A fly swarm surrounds and attacks any prey it encounters.

Description: A roiling mass of black flies. ????

Do these really need background?

Click to expand...

I guess we might as well.

How's this:

A roiling cloud of flies.

In unusual circumstances, some species of carrion-eating flies become so numerous and hungry they form dense swarms that seek to devour living creatures as well as dead bodies.

Combat
A fly swarm surrounds and attacks any edible flesh it encounters. It does not discriminate between living creatures or decomposing flesh. A fly swarm will ignore fleeing opponents if it has an immobile victim or corpse to feed upon.

Cleon said:

That's OK by me.

Updating Fly Swarm Working Draft.

I think we'd better change the "Temperate plains" to, say, "Any land".



I guess we might as well.

How's this:

A roiling cloud of flies.

In unusual circumstances, some species of carrion-eating flies become so numerous and hungry they form dense swarms that seek to devour living creatures as well as dead bodies.

Combat
A fly swarm surrounds and attacks any edible flesh it encounters. It does not discriminate between living creatures or decomposing flesh. A fly swarm will ignore fleeing opponents if it has an immobile victim or corpse to feed upon.

Click to expand...

I got bored waiting for a reply and updated the Fly Swarm Working Draft with the above changes.

That's fine. Let's call these done and move to the next conversion.

freyar said:

That's fine. Let's call these done and move to the next conversion.

Click to expand...

If I remember correctly, you wanted to do the Land Urchin next.

It ought to be pretty straightforward.

Do you fancy updating the CC's other Urchin conversions to 3.5 while we're at it? Namely the Black, Green, Red, Silver and Yellow Greater Urchins.

It'd be fairly straightforward.

Sure, let's do the land urchin here and the others in the CC update project thread. The original land urchin stats are here.

I guess we have Small Animal (except for the caveat below) with spine shooting and an dark cloud. It's blind but either had blindsense or blindsight --- or it could be a clairvoyant ability as suggested in the Monstrous Compendium version, but then it would be a Magical Beast I guess. I would prefer blindsense, I think.

freyar said:

Sure, let's do the land urchin here and the others in the CC update project thread. The original land urchin stats are here.

I guess we have Small Animal (except for the caveat below) with spine shooting and an dark cloud. It's blind but either had blindsense or blindsight --- or it could be a clairvoyant ability as suggested in the Monstrous Compendium version, but then it would be a Magical Beast I guess. I would prefer blindsense, I think.

Click to expand...

The "regular" Urchin has had clairvoyance since the original Fiend Folio version of the monster so I'd keep them Magical Beasts. They're also blind and have blindsight.

That said, the original Monster Manual II Land Urchin does not have clairvoyance, nor does it have a "magical crossbow" bonus to hit like its marine cousins. It may well be a non-magical cousin of the "Greater Urchin". Its blindsight appears to have a shorter range too, since it only attacks creatures within 1" (or ten yards).

Hmm… I could see us going for the Animal type, but the 2E Monstrous Manual version of the Land Urchin is implied to have the clairvoyance ability and +2 to hit with its spines of the Urchin's Combat section which says Magical Beast.

Hmm… let's go for the original version without clairvoyance and magical bonuses and make the type Animal if only to distinguish the Land Urchin from its "distant cousin" the Greater Urchin.

Speaking of them, the Fiend Folio Urchin had a to-hit bonus with its spines that varied with colour, from "accuracy of a +1 light crossbow" for the weakest (the Black Urchin) to "accuracy of a +5 light crossbow" to the mighty Silver Urchin.

Also, the original version of the Urchin from White Dwarf #9 was a lot faster and could fly. It had "Movement: 12″ (18″ flying)". The idea of a flying variant of these beasties is just so tempting…

We may want to bear that in mind when updating them to 3.5.

Hmm…

Anyhow, I might as well start a Working Draft for the Land Urchin as an Animal.

Land Urchin Working Draft

Urchin, Land
Small Animal
Hit Dice: 3d8+6 (16 hp)
Initiative: +5
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares)
Armor Class: 17 (+1 size, +1 Dex, +5 natural), touch 12, flat-footed 16
Base Attack/Grapple: +2/–2
Attack: Spines +4 melee (1d4 plus poison) or spine +5 ranged (1d2 plus poison)
Full Attack: Spines +4 melee (1d4 plus poison) or 6 spines +5 ranged (1d2 plus poison)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Darkness cloud, poison, spines
Special Qualities: All-around vision, blind, blindsight 30 ft.
Saves: Fort +5, Ref +4, Will +1
Abilities: Str 11, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 2, Wis 11, Cha 6
Skills: Hide +11, Search +4, Spot +4
Feats: Improved Initiative, Weapon Focus (spine)
Environment: Any temperate or warm land
Organization: Solitary or pair
Challenge Rating: 2
Treasure: See below
Advancement: 4-6 HD (Small); 7-9 HD (Medium); 10-18 HD (Large)
Advancement: None
Level Adjustment: —

This creature appears to be a ball of spines about a yard across. It stands on five spindly legs with rotating joints that allow it to walk in any direction. A short pair of antennae are the only other visible feature.

Land urchins are terrestrial cousins of the greater sea urchin. Like their distant relatives, they can shoot volleys of spines from their spherical bodies. Land urchins are scavengers able to consume anything even vaguely edible. They have a small mouth concealed on their underside with a rasping tongue able to slowly saw through shell, bone or even armor.

Land urchins try to hide or shy away from other creatures, but if a creature approaches within 10 feet the urchin will start shooting spines at it. A land urchin's spines are coated with paralytic poison and the urchin is quite willing to eat living victims paralyzed by its venom.

Land urchins sometimes create greenish-black pearls around irritants they have swallowed in a similar way to oysters. A land urchin's pearl is worth from 100 to 600 gold pieces. Particularly old urchins may contain up to a dozen pearls, but most contain only a few, one, or none at all. The market value of a land urchin's pearls never exceeds the urchin's "treasure per encounter" value (600 gp for an ordinary CR 2 land urchin and ranging up to 4,500 gp for a CR 9 Huge 18 HD land urchin).

A typical land urchin is 3 feet in diameter and weighs about 60 pounds.

Combat
Land urchins are timid scavengers who only fight in self-defense. They will shoot spines at any creature that isn't another land urchin who comes within 10 feet of them, interpreting this as a threat. If their poison paralyzes all their attackers land urchins are likely to try eating one of them. Land urchins try to escape difficult fights under cover of their darkness cloud ability.

All-Around Vision (Ex): A land urchin's antennae allow it to sense in any direction, providing a +4 racial bonus on Spot and Search checks. A land urchin can't be flanked.

Blind (Ex): A land urchin is immune to gaze attacks, visual effects, illusions, and other attack forms that rely on sight.

Darkness Cloud (Ex): A land urchin can emit a cloud of dark gas 10 feet high with a radius of 10 feet once per minute as a free action. The cloud provides total concealment, which the urchin normally uses to escape a losing fight. All vision within the cloud is obscured.

Poison (Ex): A land urchin injects its poison with a successful spine attack; Fortitude save (DC 13); initial damage paralyzed for 1d6 minutes; secondary damage paralyzed for 1d6×10 minutes.

Spines: A land urchin can slam its body into an enemy to make a melee attack with its spines, but prefers shooting its spines as missile weapons with a range increment of 80 feet. It has thousands of spines so is unlikely to run out of "ammunition".


Cryptic Land Urchin
What you took to be a small thorny bush suddenly moves, revealing itself to be a strange animal. Its "branches" are long spines that radiate from a spherical body. What appeared to be the plant's stalks are actually five fragile-seeming legs.

Some land urchins mimic the appearance of a thorn bush. This helps conceal them from predators and potential victims. A cryptic land urchin gains the following special qualities. All other traits are the same as a regular land urchin.

Mimic Bush (Ex): A cryptic land urchin closely resembles a thorn bush. Anyone who examines the urchin can detect the ruse with a successful Spot check opposed by the urchin’s Hide check. Creatures with Survival or Knowledge (nature) can use those skills instead of Spot to notice the urchin.

Skills: A cryptic land urchin has a +8 racial bonus on Hide checks when in tall grass, undergrowth or other areas where a small bush is likely to occur.

Originally appeared in Monster Manual II (1983).

I think we should change the Greater Urchin's slam attack in melee to a spines attack.

Slams do bludgeoning damage, which is wonky for a spikey creature!

i.e.:

Urchin, Land
Small Animal
Attack: Spines +4 melee (1d4 plus poison) or spine +5 ranged (1d2 plus poison)
Full Attack: Spines +4 melee (1d4 plus poison) or 6 spines +5 ranged (1d2 plus poison)

Poison (Ex): A land urchin injects its poison with a successful spine attack; Fortitude save (DC 13); initial damage paralyzed for X [?]; secondary damage paralyzed for X [?].

I like the Animal approach for the Land Urchin, just to make it a bit different from the Greater ones, sure. And I definitely prefer spines for both melee and ranged (vs slams for melee).

I can't say I see the need for the red version of Spines, but we may need to add a mention that it can ram an opponent with its spines in melee.

For poison, I guess it should be fairly long since the original measured the paralysis in turns. Maybe primary of 1d6 minutes, secondary of 1d6 hours or something like that? We could also have an underbar for variants with more lethal poisons given the MC version, but I'm not really pushing for that.

freyar said:

I like the Animal approach for the Land Urchin, just to make it a bit different from the Greater ones, sure. And I definitely prefer spines for both melee and ranged (vs slams for melee).

I can't say I see the need for the red version of Spines, but we may need to add a mention that it can ram an opponent with its spines in melee.

For poison, I guess it should be fairly long since the original measured the paralysis in turns. Maybe primary of 1d6 minutes, secondary of 1d6 hours or something like that? We could also have an underbar for variants with more lethal poisons given the MC version, but I'm not really pushing for that.

Click to expand...

I'd be inclined to go for minutes/10s of minutes.

i.e.:

Poison (Ex): A land urchin injects its poison with a successful spine attack; Fortitude save (DC 13); initial damage paralyzed for 1d6 minutes; secondary damage paralyzed for 1d6×10 minutes.

To cover the melee spines, how about:

Spines: A land urchin can slam its body into an enemy to make a melee attack with its spines, but prefers shooting its spines as missile weapons with a range increment of 80 feet. It has thousands of spines so is unlikely to run out of "ammunition".

Anyhow, we've agreed on enough for a minor update of the Land Urchin Working Draft.