D&D 5E Kender a hafling subrace

DnD Warlord said:

On there face they sound great. I HATE HATE HATE with a passion the idea that any intelligent enough to be a PC race could ever not be able to be taught any basic thing. In this case it is the above mentioned concept of personal property.

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I agree. They're fine as a NPC race but not as a PC race.

I have to laugh we derailed the lawsuit thread with a dozen or so people talking about the kender problem so I made a sepytheead asking for how to fix it... and more then half of the responses pretend there is no kender problem.

I agree with the Daleks on this one.

Exterminate.

DnD Warlord said:

If you dislike and would not want to play with a kender as is, what is the most minor tweek you think that could allow it?

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Either:

1) Your kender is really just an individual halfling with no respect for personal property. They are not a member of an entire culture that cannot grasp the concept of personal ownership of property. You are not protected from the consequences of your actions because you are "cute".

2) There's a culture of halflings that have a communal lifestyle, with no real need for personal property. They have enough sense to not walk off with random objects that have value and use when they don't need them, as while they don't think those items are personal, those items are of use to the community, and must be available to fulfill that use. They think all this concentration of personally owning things is kind of dumb, and dont tend to accumulate personal wealth. In the outer world, they may have a tendency of borrowing items without asking, out of habit, but only when they actually intend to use them, and they put them back when they are done, so the next person in the community can use them. You may be somewhat protected for taking items that you were hoping to use, because your people are known for borrowing, not stealing.

Umbran said:

Either:

1) Your kender is really just an individual halfling with no respect for personal property. They are not a member of an entire culture that cannot grasp the concept of personal ownership of property. You are not protected from the consequences of your actions because you are "cute".

2) There's a culture of halflings that have a communal lifestyle, with no real need for personal property. They have enough sense to not walk off with random objects that have value and use when they don't need them, as while they don't think those items are personal, those items are of use to the community, and must be available to fulfill that use. They think all this concentration of personally owning things is kind of dumb. In the outer world, they may have a tendency of borrowing items without asking, out of habit, but only when they actually intend to use them, and they put them back when they are done, so the next person in the community can use them.

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I think your option 2 is a sensible way for culture like this to actually exist.

I guess I'm in the minority of actually liking the kender. I'm really not a fan of Dragonlance, but I found the kender to be a nice fresh take on the halflings (if somewhat crude and cartoonish one.) So the halfling-equivalents I play or that appear in my settings tend to be more like the kender and less like the hobbits. Granted, I get how the kleptomania angle can easily get super annoying, but I really don't think that is their defining feature, it is merely a one expression of their carefree and optimistic nature.

Umbran said:

Either:

1) Your kender is really just an individual halfling with no respect for personal property. They are not a member of an entire culture that cannot grasp the concept of personal ownership of property. You are not protected from the consequences of your actions because you are "cute".

2) There's a culture of halflings that have a communal lifestyle, with no real need for personal property. They have enough sense to not walk off with random objects that have value and use when they don't need them, as while they don't think those items are personal, those items are of use to the community, and must be available to fulfill that use. They think all this concentration of personally owning things is kind of dumb, and dont tend to accumulate personal wealth. In the outer world, they may have a tendency of borrowing items without asking, out of habit, but only when they actually intend to use them, and they put them back when they are done, so the next person in the community can use them. You may be somewhat protected for taking items that you were hoping to use, because your people are known for borrowing, not stealing.

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I like your take on it

I think if I were creating a kender race for dragonlance, I'd just go with the lightfoot halfling subrace and add sleight of hand proficiency. I think the rest of the halfling and lightfoot traits fit well for kender.

Grandpa, why are the other people calling us thieves and throwing rock at us?

We are not stealing items. We are handling them. The difference baffles the rest of the races because only kender can hear the plea of the object-spirits yearning to be free. Most race are too blinded by the feeling they are entitled to OWN things to realize that they are doing something deeply amoral by enthralling objects they have no immediate use of enslaving them. In some case, those property-minded humans even stoop to put their objects into small jails --- they call them chests -- where they can't even see the beauty of the flowers in the gardens... We kender are mindful of the objects, we don't believe in slavery, that's why we're taking them: to salute them and allow them some degree of freedom of movement that object-spirits should enjoy, too.

Grandpa, are the humans all evil?

No, because they are just not smart enough to accept that objects have rights. Some of them are evil, of course, but for most of them, it's just an inability to understand a basic concept that slavery is bad and listening the voice of the objects. You can't blame them for that, they are simply lacking proper education. In their worldview, it's perfecty OK to "own" people, animals, objects and even more ludicrously, some of them seem to think they can own PLACES and IDEAS.

No, grandpa, this is too ludicrous, nobody of a playable race can think like that, we're past of the age of fairy tales.

They call themselves copyright-holders.

Grandpa, what should we do when visiting a human town? Should we become like them?

No. It's not because you're living amid murderers that you should commit murders yourselves. Don't enslave objects because the humans say it's all-OK. Keep our superior, freedom-loving, cultural value and make a point of refusing to abide by their barbaric customs. You all know what stealing is, and you shouldn't do that, but by all mean continue to handle objects.

Kender are a chapter of Space Marines with a somewhat popular game franchise.

Crimson Longinus said:

I think your option 2 is a sensible way for culture like this to actually exist.

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DnD Warlord said:

I like your take on it

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Thank you. It seems a pretty natural approach for good-aligned, small creatures in a world filled with much larger, aggressive critters. If you don't have the size, but have cooperation, you can go a long way.