11th level order

[vhailor]

When I gain my 11th level, can I choose the feat before I choose which path I'll follow, or do I follow the order the PHB(p.29) has? (+1 to all, paragon path features, gain 1 paragon path encounter attack power, gain 1 feat)
I want to take the Pact Initiate at 11th level and choose a warlock path. Is that possible?

 

[Mirtek]

By RAW you would follow the sequence as laid out on pages 27-28 PHB.

So if you want to get a MC-Feat to get the PP from annother class take it before 11th lvl. Or talk to your DM if he wants to allow a small exception.

I did once think about a similar problem with an avenger going Studen of Caiphon for extra crit-range. Starting stats (post racial) would have been

Str 08, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 18, Cha 12

Unfortunately Student of Caiphon requires Warlock-MC and that requires Cha 13. I was thinking about getting both at 11th level immediately before chosing the PP but the plan resolved on the level-up-order (would get Cha 13 just in time, but would not be able to MC-Warlock before having to chose the PP).

Since this was planed as an LFR character I can't convince a DM to houserule

 

[Siberys]

I've always run it that they happen simultaneously, so player chooses the order. That may be from the number of card games I play, though, where that'd be the case from multiple things triggering off of one event.

 

[Shroomy]

By RAW you would follow the sequence as laid out on pages 27-28 PHB.

So if you want to get a MC-Feat to get the PP from annother class take it before 11th lvl. Or talk to your DM if he wants to allow a small exception.

I did once think about a similar problem with an avenger going Studen of Caiphon for extra crit-range. Starting stats (post racial) would have been

Str 08, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 18, Cha 12

Unfortunately Student of Caiphon requires Warlock-MC and that requires Cha 13. I was thinking about getting both at 11th level immediately before chosing the PP but the plan resolved on the level-up-order (would get Cha 13 just in time, but would not be able to MC-Warlock before having to chose the PP).

Since this was planed as an LFR character I can't convince a DM to houserule

Is this clarified anywhere (in the errata)? I don't see anywhere in the PHB pg 27-28 that specifically says that you have to level up in any particular order, and we've always played that you could do it in any order you like.

 

[Siberys]

Well, one could say the step-by-step listing on page 27 defines the order. Not that I subscribe to that particular belief.

Ah, the joys of being the DM.

 

[Shroomy]

Well, one could say the step-by-step listing on page 27 defines the order. Not that I subscribe to that particular belief.

Ah, the joys of being the DM.

He said it was for a LFR character, which is why I'm wondering it was some sort of official ruling. I'm like you and take the order on pg. 27 to be more of a suggestion; IMO 4e allows for a lot of player choice and retraining at each level, so it seems odd to me if this order was set in stone.

 

[Jack99]

He said it was for a LFR character, which is why I'm wondering it was some sort of official ruling. I'm like you and take the order on pg. 27 to be more of a suggestion; IMO 4e allows for a lot of player choice and retraining at each level, so it seems odd to me if this order was set in stone.

Cant remember seeing anything anywhere about the order.

 

[keterys]

For a strict RAW game, I'd say the fact that it's a clear numbered 'step by step' order means that you can't rearrange the steps.

That said, Retraining itself is separate from that order so I'd say you could do it at any time. This is important for if you need to retrain something so that you can obtain a feat that it gives you the prerequisite for (such as retraining for pact initiate, then at step 6 taking novice power)

Which I think means you can get away with what you want to do - both of you, even.

 

[shadowoflameth]

The epic destiny rules allow you to delay, and like those , the paragon path abilities are separate mechanically from your normal suite of powers. I would be inclined to allow delaying. Retraining could certainly do the same thing if you want to make the player do that, then at least, they are spending their retrain option for that level to do it.

 

[Lord Sessadore]

I interpret the steps as "make sure you do all of these, so that you don't miss any new and/or improved stats", not "you must do things in this order". Mind you, that's just how I treat most things. For example, most math processes I don't memorize a "step 1, step 2" approach, I just remember all the things that have to be done to get to the end result.